NL-Well I went into my AVN awards account yesterday to do my priliminary voting. You don’t just pick one winner, you have to put all the noms in order from best to worst. That’s really tough. In many situations there were so many good people/movies that is really hard to choose who should be put ahead of whom. And in a few categories, I felt like, well they are all equally bad, lol. But overall I think AVN got it right as they always do, as to who should be nominated. Yeah, there are a few people/movies I think should be on a list that aren’t and there are a few that I don’t think deserve to be there. But lets be realistic, that’s my opinion. Wading through all the performers, directors, sex scenes etc in (I’m guessing) 10,000 movies is a hell of a job. And the AVN team did a great one.
So my first time through the whole voting site took about three hours. I will watch a few movies I missed this weekend and go back and redo my votes. Hopefully by Monday I will be have made all my decisions and be ready to cast my final votes. It’s tough though. In many categories there are a couple people that deserve to be at the top, and only one can get the award. And an AVN award in any category is a big notch on the belt for a performer or company. But certain categories, like Performer of the Year & New Starlet of the Year can change people’s life and financial future for the better. So I take this job very seriously…..
I’m curious as to what categories you felt were full of “all equally bad” choices. Given your comments, I suspect you’re only voting in a handful of categories since the screeners are still coming in (in droves no less). I doubt winning a bunch of awards impacts anyone’s financial future but yeah, if you’re going to vote, spend some time doing it right. 🙂
My concern is obviously not with you Cindi by any means but I do have some concern over some of the judges just by some of the inappropriate things they tweet. I obviously don’t know who all of the judges are but when some of them tweet direct and extremely inappropriate things about specific porn stars, directly insulting them, I think that should make then unqualified for being allowed to be an AVN judge. If you can’t help but go out of your way to treat others badly, openly – then I can’t help but think that your judgment is obviously biased and that isn’t a good “judge” to me.
I got a phone call one day from a porn star in tears upset about something said on Twitter but an AVN judge. That just infuriated me. To openly and publicly insult a porn star, not for anything they did stupid like take drugs or get it a fight but just based on their thoughts of their looks is just so so so so wrong.
To me, a judge so be able to do his or her job without bias. I mean let’s say I don’t like a certain producer or director for whatever reason. I biased judge would then not vote for him (or her) no matter what because he doesn’t like them and that’s just wrong to me.
I know I’m naive to think the world should work this way but whatever, I do. I think everyone should have an equal and fair chance to win and nobody should have to worry about biased judges going out of their way to vote against them just because they don’t like you for whatever reason.
Kelli,
I think your concerns are largely addressed by the fact that the voting pool is larger than most award events (X-biz is a couple of guys, the Urban awards a few people, CAVR is one guy, etc.), including people employed at AVN as well as others with an expansive enough background in the field. From my own experience, each of the judges has their own likes, dislikes, and personal tastes too (each of these considered a “bias”); making the final outcome more representative of their fields of expertise.
The whole idea of voting is to apply your biases to be factored in with all other voters for a final outcome. In the end, there can be only one winner (rarely a tie) and to suggest looks aren’t going to be a factor in something as visually oriented as porn is just silly. Further, trying to censor someone in a field so dependent upon free speech is quite revealing.
I know the tendency for some is to apply the high school social model to voting (based on personal factors rather than those directly related to the category) just as others speak of the business model of voting (voting based solely on who spends the most in advertising) but I have to hand it to Mr. Fishbein for bringing in additional voters based on their expertise to round out the voting pool. By doing so, he strengthened the potential outcome and addressed criticisms long held by many. 🙂
That is a very good point you made about having a large pool of judges with the AVN awards.
I guess really my concern / complaint is verbal attack on these girls in any capacity, by any person within the industry.
I don’t like seeing it. I’m not saying the girls are perfect but I don’t think there is ever really a reason for anyone within our own industry to be attacking our girls, especially when they’ve done nothing wrong.
Sure you have the right to have your own likes and dislikes but that’s not an excuse to tweet someone and say there is no reason for them to have ever been in porn because they suck so bad. Right? ^^
Kelli, thanks!
One of the things about free speech we all have to live with is seeing opinions we don’t agree with from time to time. If one were to take your comment to heart, there would be absolutely no capacity for criticism whatsoever; the antithesis of free speech. As a publicist and screenplay writer yourself, surely you see the problem with that idea, yes?
I even looked through my own tweets for the last month to see if I might be one of the offending parties, sadly nothing negative about performers showing up (though our host sure had some negative comments about Justin) lol. But I suppose if someone is really, really bad at giving blowjobs (ie: “suck so bad”), they probably shouldn’t specialize in blowjob-only movies.
On a related note, do you think judges should consider only the movies made or everything about them? For example, some people really hate it when directors repeatedly release press releases about how great their works are. Regardless of the quality of those movies, those people refuse to watch his flicks. To me, that’s dumber than voting against a director with a history of screwing people over on advertising payments (you know who). Stick with the works up for awards and leave the personalities aside…
Truth is, you are right. You have just as much right to hate on a porn star, as I do to be bothered by it. I mean that is the joy of free speech. Sure in a perfect world everyone would be all happy happy joy joy and nobody would ever fight, but in reality, that isn’t the case and well, while I wished you guys would be kinder and gentler to some of the girls and not call them things like ugly or fat, it really isn’t right to want to censor what you say either. I can’t want free speech on one hand and then complain about it on the other.
ok let me put my 2 cents in on this. First of all, how do we know who the AVN judges are?
I have found over the years that old saying to be very applicable to the porn biz, “You can please some of the people some of the time…”
Everyone has their likes and dislikes but in the porn world it’s far more serious and personal, and when you make those people judges for awards, it can seriously affect the outcome. For instance, if a judge has a thing for fetish content he certainly isn’t going to be as fair and balanced in his voting when there are teen seduction nominees or some of this lame cheesy content like “Big Sausage Pizza” for example.
The same goes for review sites. I have had my site reviewed many times over the years and not once did I think they were accurate or fair. One of the judges at the Bestporn.com outright says he has a thing for Teen sites. Well if he’s reviewing a Housewife MILF site what could anyone expect his review to say?
All of that aside, the AVN awards are probably the most corrupt awards out there. How is it that the same girls are nominated year after year…err, Jenna Haze? Really? Does good scenes for sure and works steady and contributes to the industry…it doesn’t hurt she was half of a power couple who spent tons of advertising dollars in the magazine. I’m nominated again this year but know I won’t win. I’m ok with it because I accept things as they are in this award bullshit.
The trick is to not take it seriously or personally. it’s business and awarding those who keep that business alive.
Mariah, for years, most or all of the voters worked directly for AVN. In recent times, this has been expanded a little to include a number of recognized experts, the company even introducing some fan-based awards now. I’m not sure if a definitive list of judges has been made public but each of them that I’m familiar with have more than a passing knowledge of the subject matter.
Like Kelli’s concern, yours is addressed better by the expansion of the voting pool than any other method available. In addition, there are lots of categories so that one man’s fetish doesn’t overwhelm the vote (as it most certainly does with the one man or two man awards). The opposite criticism is that with so many categories, almost everyone can win something but the alternative is to compare apples to oranges.
While I can’t speak for websites that review other websites, reviews in general are a single person’s take on a subject. Regarding why specific performers get repeatedly nominated, you said it yourself, a woman like Jenna Haze is a good performer, is used by a wide variety of companies, has a look that appeals to a wider audience, and isn’t shy about doing all sorts of things that some of her peers won’t do. By doing more scenes in bigger variety of genres, especially for a long period of time, she builds up an industry following surpassing a single niche like MILF. She still doesn’t win top female performer every year but yeah, she’d have a better shot at it than someone who doesn’t get their name out there beyond their own fan base.
I agree that some take awards too seriously so just have fun with them and enjoy the show. 🙂
I think Mariah should get a avn award for her wild, hot performences. She’s been around longer and I think is a bette female performer than that COKE heads out there than the COKE heads out there and has more drive and stanima then some of the younggirls..ALOT MORE!
Here’s my two cents. A few years ago when SexZ Pictures won AVN’s Best Video Award 2 years in a row, that pretty much ended any possible thought at least in my head that the awards were tainted. There was NO REASON for AVN to give it to SexZ again because much bigger advertisers like Wicked, Hustler, Vivid and others had worthy movies in that category but the voters picked Upload to win. During the awards show we were all drunk, surprised and very happy that our table won again (We used to market all of those movies) but none of us really expected it. The fact was that Eli Cross made another great and disturbing picture and the voters loved it. It would have been sooooo easy for AVN to give it to Wicked and nobody would have blinked an eye but I think the voters are really in charge. Now I’m not saying everything is so clear cut but in my mind this is a pretty legit process. Hustler has been a huge advertiser and they do not get lavished with ‘paid for’ awards. Jenna Haze for a long time had and actually still has the ‘it’ factor plus she seems to find herself in big movies and as Don Houston pointed out she pretty much does everything and that helps win her votes. An unknown might have a more difficult time winning something but that doesn’t mean it never happens because it does.
In January I am going to the AVN Awards with pretty modest expectations but I guarantee I will have a great time drinking, partying and watching Axel burn a hole in the carpet walking up to the stage. Now if only I can find a cute date.
Rick, I like older women over young girls too and I’ve spoken highly of Mariah in reviews but she has made a handful of titles in the last year. Compare her on a point by point basis to the other nominees and she will fare better than some, worse than others. Jenna Haze, in addition to being everywhere and doing everything really well, also directed some of the best smut released, her career never limited to second through fourth tier companies as others have largely been.
Will, also remember that the initial reviews of Corruption were so negative that it took a virtual grass roots campaign to get reviewers/critics/voters to take a second look at it. Upload wasn’t the complete dark horse the second year but yeah, in each case Eli had an uphill climb considering the sheer familiarity of other titles he was up against. Advertising is only one way to bring titles to the attention of others (including voters), and not a bad way at all, but titles that win a lot of awards tend to be so heavily promoted in all sorts of ways that the continued claim of “pay for play” fails over and over again.
I take nothing away from Jenna Haze…seriously. I don’t know her personally but I know about her career and she has done it to the fullest and I applaud her for it.
I shot maybe 10 scenes this year for productions other than my own so I expect to win or be nominated for nothing more than my website, which I am nominated for. Last year I was nominated for best web starlet. I should have a legit shot at the award this year. My site is improved 110% over last year and updates are almost daily, with a lot of new content being added…and the most important thing…I own it and run it 100% myself. Almost all of the other nominees’ sites are run by webmasters which to me should detract from their possibilities.
Will, you NEVER have a problem with the dates…perhaps your fame has jaded you and cute has a whole new level of standards these days?????? 🙂 I’m sure you will do fine!
Mariah, you were the one suggesting there was something wrong with Jenna Haze being repeatedly nominated, even implying her BF was part of the reason. That you were nominated with such a small number of scenes speaks highly of your performances, it’s just a tough row to hoe competing against those with 20 times as many performances.
As far as the website stuff, I don’t vote in those categories since I’m not up on them but hopefully those judges will be aware of how busy you are on it, the degree of control you have, and that the website quality speaks for itself. Oh, and yeah, Will having trouble with finding a hot date is hilarious, most guys would willingly take his rejects…
The second porn girl I ever wanted to hook up with was Mariah but sadly that has yet to happen. Amber Lynn was the first porn lust many, many years earlier after I met her in 1986 at the AEE convention in Chicago but that never happened either. WTF? LOL.
i had a crush on amber lynn too, i mean the curves on that lady and legs… those were pornstars.
@Kelli
if the model cant handle to be judged on her LOOKS, perhaps she should be in a different industry?
I mean, its 99% looks and 0.5% personality…
Mariah’s got curves and legs and the looks too! I was over BBq’ing over a friends house the last weekend and he had Mariah’s poster above his bed Doggy Style! LOL Damnn I guess you can call the PISA a real porn fan!
Yeah secondly, I think William will get a award this year! Why not everybody else is copying him. Will What happen to KISS?? or the other porn musicals?
Mariah, one of the best pieces of advice that someone gave me (that I’m just now figuring out how to apply to my own life) is to not worry about what other people are doing and especially not what they’re receiving.
AVN awards from my perspective are given to “icons” when it comes to performers. That’s all fine and dandy but if I were you I’d be shooting for one of the “operating system” awards (in other words shoot for a directorial or studio award).
From what I can see you are beyond being a mere performer – time to establish yourself as the newest version of Windows 🙂 If you can manage to do that you can get as many icon awards as you like, but by then you probably won’t want to even bother.
Its hard to compare todays porn frankensteinettes created in a lab with rock hard implants, tattoos and piercings everywhere, and lots of plastic surgery to the original porn girls that were just beautiful women. Girls like Leslie Bovee, Amber Lynn, Seka, Rhonda Jo Petty, Deserie Cousteau, etc…
Will I was in your first porn movie you directed! 🙂 And don’t date yourself like that with the 1986 AEE info! Damn you’re old! 🙂
Houstondon I wasn’t saying there is something “wrong” with her being nominated every year…I do think however that if she were to shoot 3 scenes all year she would still be nominated. My point is that the nomination committee has a pre-determined number of people and then they add some in after. Does that make sense? Basically there are certain girls/companies who are going to get nominations no matter what and then other nominees will be added in as a secondary consideration.
Hey Will can you shoot me an email I have something I want you to see. hubba hubbba 🙂 mariah@mariahxxx.net
Monica
thanks babe. I have a huge project I am working on at the moment and I am planning on this getting me a nod next year. From what’s been shot so far I can guarantee its as good if not better than anything that I’ve seen in my 12 years in this business and maybe there’s some bias because it’s mine, but I’m really serious. So we’ll see how straight up the process is next year. I love Steve Javors and I love Dan Miller, and I sincerely doubt that either of them run a corrupt organization. I just think that when you look at some of the things that are nominated and winning it doesn’t make sense. Features are great but honestly, is that still the mainstream of porn? Does anyone really believe that the stuff being produced these days is erotic at all? The sex has been compromised for the story which is fucking retarded to me. I just shot for a company yesterday and there were 34 extras on set all day and you would have thought an episode of Law and Order was being shot. The script was 25 pages long. it’s fucking porn folks. Keep your script but why can’t someone make something that is sexy and erotic like Andrew Blake does but still keep their story line?
I challenge anyone reading this to point out a single nomination for best picture or best release that is erotic. just one.
Monica, while there may be a tendency for “icons” to get awards, remember that they are considered icons for a reason. 🙂
Karmafan, I will never get tired of Annette Haven either but there are a great many all natural performers today as well that don’t go overboard with tattoos and piercings.
Mariah, you may be right about her likelihood to be nominated while less productive. I wasn’t her biggest fan for much of her career myself but eventually came around. Tastes change so while I suspect guys like Manuel Ferrera, Tommy Gunn, and Evan Stone will always be on any mainstream top pick list, there will always be challengers too. Given the voting pool, you just never know who will win.
Features comprise a relatively small portion of the voting pool too but there are reasons for this as well. Just as the parody craze has literally swept the industry (largely courtesy of the King of Parodies himself; Will Ryder) and now expanded into two categories, features have always been a show mainstay able to separate performers that can only fuck from those that can act as well as fuck (admittedly with mixed results at times). Features are considered to be tougher to make successfully and there are always going to be genre fans supporting them over clips of random fucking.
What constitutes “erotic” is in the eye of the beholder, for my purposes meaning if a scene or movie warms me up for some hand to gland action or a tryst with a GF. I suspect you mean something more traditional in your challenge so I’d suggest you get a copy of Blake’s own “Voyeur Within” (Best High End All Sex Release), Just Jenna (Best All Sex Release) or maybe “Girl Crush (Best All Girl Release), as these might work for you. If there is nothing on the nominations list that appeals to you though, it might make more sense to look inward.
Jenna Haze will always get a large number of nominations because anything with her on the box sells extremely well. Hence, it makes sense for a company to push her for nominations because they will make that money back due to all the publicity and then some. Jenna is always a solid investment in that sense. The supermodels of the industry have more opportunities at awards time because people make the most money off them. Even if a company doesn’t win an award, having Jenna Haze as their nominee got them more attention than having a lesser known performer from a lower tier of similar ability.
I know other performers like to hate on Jenna Haze, but it isn’t just the fact that she has perfect looks for porn, but the addition of how she manages her career that makes her A list. She has earned all those nominations.
To HoustonDon,
I understand exactly why you’re stating what you’re stating, and I can also understand your perspective from a logical mass societal standpoint – however one has to figure out if that “reason” is something that they want for themselves – and if that reason is really all that it’s cracked up to be. I don’t know Mariah personally, so I don’t know what she really wants for herself…but what I do know if that from what she allows us to see and know of her – she’s far beyond ever needing to be an “icon” – she’s leapfrogged over that phase in her career. Some individuals can do that – others can not.
It all depends on what level you choose to live on, why and so forth I suppose. Some individuals in rafts go with the tide and find themselves becoming who they are which is why they are who they are – others have jets engines attached to their boats.
I personally feel that features (along with the contract performer – male and female) will be making a resurgence…but that’s just me.
Agreeing to disagree is fun.
To Mariah:
I’m very excited to see your work once it’s released (and touch base with me to meet up if you plan on being in Miami over the holidays, as I’ll be in that area).
Keep that jet engine of yours roaring. People in rowboats are boring (though necessary being that they’re essentially the world’s mindless drone like workforce) and never end up anywhere that they really have dreamed of being, because they’re to scared to go against the tide. Stay fearless and be a true leader always.
hey Monica thank you 🙂
One thing I will always be is fearless lol Outspoken is another 🙂
I am headed to LA for the holidays and won’t be back to Florida until the 3rd of January. You don’t live in Miami do you? I thought it was LA???
here’s a link to the trailer for the first episode
http://pornstarvampire.com/ty-video-episode1.html
(this trailer is just a reduced version of the full-length…this is NOT a production trailer) but you get the general idea and a good example of the quality. I’m keeping it fetish and there is going to be some really hot hardcore also. plus there’s a secret element that won’t be announced until the release.
thanks again Monica! You do the same. You seem to be making your own path as well…great to see that!
Features are the one thing in this business that keeps us valid to the mainstream market even though it’s the gonzo porn that is thing people most want to watch. Most men would fast forward through dialogue in a porn film as they always have, but the couples element and the market for women has grown big time since the internet made it so available. Just my opinion.
2005 AVN Voters as per their DVD release:
AVN voters: Tim Connelly Mike Ramone
Dan Miller Heidi Pike-Johnson
Paul Fishbein Mark Kernes
Jared Rutter Peter Warren
Scott Ross Stuart Franks
Darren Roberts Acme Anderson
Simon Auch John Castro
Darklady Jay Moyes
Dirty Bob Jesse Dena
Danny Estrada Jerome Horwitz
Ferror Ignique Natalie Katz
Crickett Lancaster Naomi LeRoy
Dana Jones Cindi Loftus
Steve Mata Frank Meyer
Bradley Milton Pistol Pete
Roger T. Pipe Lori Selke
Donna Shapiro Brian Sieck
Marc Star Neil Starks
David Tesseo Matt Torrence
Leo Veleff
2005 is the last AVN DVD I have reviewed.
Den
Monica,
I’m in agreement that Mariah is a better performer than most newcomers from what I’ve seen. I don’t see how her winning an award or not would impact that in the slightest, just as I wouldn’t expect your skills (as aptly displayed in two of my favorite parodies, Ryder’s Not the Cosby XXX titles) to change as a result.
While all sales are down, features must be selling enough to justify the current parody craze too. It’s not like one person woke up one day and made the decision for the rest of the industry. If they get more attention than gonzo flicks, that has as much to do with the people buying them as anything else. The contract performer system has sure taken a lot of lumps in recent years with performers melting down on a regular basis and talking smack about their employer behind their back but you may be correct if someone can make a broken system work again. I hope she fares as well with her nominations as she deserves, regardless of who else is up for the same awards.
Den, many of those voters have since left the voting pool. I won’t comment on who else is currently a member except for those so publicized of late, Dr Jay, The Mooninite, Chris Thorne, Apache Warrior, Roger Pipe Bobo-One, and Cindi Loftis, but a larger pool of voters helps reduce biases. It may introduce other issues but just like the XRCO, the voting pool knows collectively a lot more than smaller awards.
Well, back to powering up my rocket powered raft for one last push in the voting process. Good luck!