Subject: Re: ShynessFrom: Underdog <blueoak@sprintmail.com>

Date: 1998/03/04Message-ID: <34FD9CC1.67@sprintmail.com>

Newsgroups: alt.psychology.nlp

Dan Weissmann wrote:>

> Hi people. I've been interested in NLP for a while but am far from a > professional...just a curious layman, I guess. I was wondering if anyone > here could give me some advice/suggestions for dealing with shyness, in > particular with the opposite camp. I know you can't really "do therapy" over > the internet but the fact is, I'm in mid-divorce and all my money goes to my > attorney :) A few people suggested attending Carmine Baffa's seminars, > while others have suggested Ross Jeffries. However, it seems to me you need > some degree of balls to start with when following their advice. In my case, > I feel nothing less than mute terror when I'm around women.> > Thanks for the input.>> Dan

Hmmmmm.....How to start starting when starting is the problem........this is a poser!

Fortunately, it is the kind of problem that once you begin to remedy, is like a snowball rolling down a mountain. The energy and momentum keep building until you don't even remember what it was like to have been anything other than totally comfortable and self possessed in anysituation.

I can relate to what you are experiencing. As a former "nice-guy" I know what it is like to be completely at the mercy of your own perceptions of what is going on in the mind of a woman you desperately want to speak to, but have no idea how to go about it. And then when you do screw up the courage finally, to do something, anything!...she either blows you off or is so wrong for you that you wonder why you ever made the supreme effort.

Boy...for anyone who knows how I tend to get when replying, (long-winded) hang on. I feel a Sou'Wester coming on. Once the hot rains come, the mud is going to get pretty deep in here. Save yourself!

Dan, have you ever wondered why it seems like guys who treat women like dirt always have gorgeous fems by their side? And why it seems that nice guys can't get the time of day even though women swear that a guy who will treat them well is exactly what they want? Naw, me either. ;-)

But it is an interesting question. It has to do with human nature.

Everyone values what they have to work for way more than they value what is given to them for nothing. Ever have someone offer to give you something for free? I bet your first reaction is to say to yourself, "What's the catch?" I know mine is. So is almost everybody's. Those beautiful women you see with schmucks are no different. They are working very hard for approval from those guys. And because they have learned to see themselves as having value only for their beauty, they do not know that they can be valued for anything else. They are trapped by themselves. And if you had one of them you would be miserable. They are what is known as high-maintenance. No, you are looking for someone quite different. She will still be beautiful. She will just be so much more besides. And her beauty will be based in not just physical characteristics. But in the way she laughs and holds herself and values you for your strengths. And she will value you because you will have the strength to make her earn you.

I assume that, going through a divorce right now, you want to meet someone with whom you are actually compatible, as opposed to someone with whom you really have nothing in common other than proximity or her willingness to glom onto you like a leech because she needs a few things and sees her sex as a coupon to be redeemed for your valuable time and energy. There are just as many female predators as male ones out there.

They just come in somewhat different disguises. They know how to trigger your desire to "help" people and use it to wrap you up into a compliant ball of meek acceptance of whatever they want to hand out....if you let them. And shy guys are prone to meeting this kind of woman. It is the very fact that a shy guy is not willing to make the first move that leaves him so hungry for companionship that he will accept whoever comes up to him and makes their move on him. Healthy normal women don't often do this. Mostly it is women who can spot a mark when they see one. So, as odd as it sounds, when you are desperate to meet ANYONE......be picky.

Way before I ever heard about NLP, a friend of mine took me under his wing and tried to teach me what he knew about meeting women. He was quite successful at meeting any woman he wanted to. I remember one time we were sitting in a bar in the afternoon having lunch. He said he was going out to the car for a pack of cigarettes. Half an hour later, I get a call at the bar. He met someone in the parking lot and was at her apartment. This was common stuff with him. No one was more surprised than me when a few years later, Skip was getting married and taking himself off the market. He had found someone with whom what he gave, was equally met with what he needed. They are still happily married married and have teenagers. And I'm fairly certain he has never strayed because he is getting what he needs from the relationship. And she will not put up with any crap either, because she values herself enough to insist on her OWN happiness.

That is the key, I think. Find someone who doesn't NEED you. Find someone who WANTS to be with you, but has enough of her own identity to be self-sufficient. In a healthy relationship it is not 50-50. That only adds up to 100%. It must be 100-100. Both people have a hundred percent to give and that should add up to 200%. Anything less is short-changing yourself. That means you can look out for each other half the time and not be left without resources to also look out for yourself. Everyone is responsible for their own happiness. No one else can do it for you. They can share it. But you have to generate it. And if you are not generating it, that is a communication with yourself you should pay attention to.

And you can not generate it for her either, She has to do that. If you fall for the trap of trying to do it for her, she will not appreciate it. She will just learn to despise you. It is tempting. But don't fall for it. Insist on her relying on herself. She will appreciate it in the long run. And if you do not insist, she will not respect you and hence will not respect herself for being with you. This is human nature. It works the same way in reverse. No one respects someone who lets them walk all over them. They may use them because they don't have a better idea of what to do. But they will not be happy.

Why am I wasting so much time here on this stuff that doesn't seem to relate at all to the question of MEETING women? I dunno. Maybe because I've seen so many guys waste so much on poor relationships because they were desperate. One good thing about your shyness. When used properly, it will make a great filter for weeding out the kind of women you DON'T want to meet. That is WAY more than half the solution.

Back to Skip's advice. I was a complete nerd in those days. Awkward, shy, no idea how to approach a woman. Skip told me a few things that he said were key. First, (and toughest) you have to actually speak to a woman. Ninety% of guys stand around looking at women they think are attractive and say to themselves, "Boy, I wish I could go talk to her."

But they don't make the obvious conection that they could do just that.

They don't realize that if they do and get turned down they will be in exactly the same spot they are now. Not talking to her. Fear of her thinking them foolish stops them cold. So, just by going up and talking to a woman you place yourself in the top ten percent.

Second, it doesn't matter what line you use. The woman has already decided whether or not she likes you enough to give you a chance. I have seen the most beautiful women light up like an angel when hearing the most trite crap imaginable. And I've seen bright and witty conversational openers fall flat with the guy feeling like pond scum as he crawls away. It doesn't matter what you say. Say something. Anything.

She will decide before you open your mouth how good your line is. The important thing is to look right into her eyes as you speak. And do not look away first. Let her look away first. VERY IMPORTANT! Let her look away first. And smile. You may have to remember to do that at first until it comes naturally to you. A stricken look is not atractive to women. Congratulations! You are now in a position that 9 out of ten guys in any given situation will not even attempt. They will just wish they had the confidence you do now.

Third. Ask questions. Ask about anything you can think of, as long as it relates to her. This does two things. It gives her something comfortable to talk about that she can concentrate on while giving her the opportunity to access her feelings and find where she wants to place you in them. And it avoids those long uncomfortable pauses in the conversation. Funny is good. Slightly self-deprecating is good too.

Slightly. If she has something unusual about her that is a choice, comment on it. If it is something she has no choice about, like beautiful red hair, or an incredible classic greek nose, do not mention it. She has already heard everything possible you can imagine and you will just be risking hitting a sore spot. If she is wearing a hat or anything you can see she took the trouble to differentiate herself with...tatoo....piercing...funky shoes...anything, compliment her on it.

Now a lot of Ross's stuff could come in here so if you want to you can look into that. In fact, if you buy his equalizer tape through his web page it will probably be of great use to you. Remember that these are just tools and what you do with them is your own responsibility. A hammer can be used to build or destroy, so take care when wielding it.

Fourth. And maybe more important than the other three. BEFORE you approach anyone, observe who is interested in you. Most guys look around and see who THEY want to meet and focus on them, whether or not the women they desire are in the least interested. This is setting yourself up to fail unless you are one of the rare few who can sell themselves to anyone. I trust this doesn't desribe you in the past or you wouldn't have posted this question. It may be you in the future if you learn NLP.

But, baby steps...baby steps...heheheheh

If you spend just a couple minutes observing people, you will be able to tell who is noticing you. She may just look your way, or shift her posture toward you or smile or touch her hair. I have a clue for you. If she looks at you for more than a split second and doesn't make a face of wretched disgust, she would like you to approach her. This will happen in just a very quick second so you have to watch for it. You will also have to watch out for your tendency to look away when she "catches" you looking at her. Once a woman sees you looking at them, you are making your first impression. It is the one that is most "key" in her decision of whether or not she likes you. As I said, the opener doesn't matter.

She's already decided before you open your mouth. If you only approach women who are already interested in you, your success rate, and hence your confidence, will grow.

So, when she catches your eye, instead of looking guiltily away, smile!

Then go back to observing the room. This will ooze confidence and in fact will cause you to actually feel more confident. You will know that if you decide to talk to her you will be warmly received. And if you do not decide to approach her you have lost nothing. Just gained a warm feeling. Of course, if when you smile she does not react well (you will know. Just trust yourself and go with your own feeling about it.) you will not have wasted any of your time or been shot down by approaching a non-interested party. There are many reasons for someone not to be interested. Ninety-nine percent don't involve you at all so don't waste time worrying about it. Just stick to the delicious few who are.

Now to the part you actually asked about! How to get the confidence to even attempt this stuff to begin with. Are you alone? If not print this out and do it when you are. And when you won't be disturbed for a little while. Then be sure you actually do it. If you just read about it, it won't have nearly the effect it is going to have on you at a very fundamental level...

What do you enjoy doing? What is something you would get up early on Sunday morning to do? Or drive fifty miles to do? Got it? Tap yourself twice right in the middle of your forehead between your eyes, using your middle finger. Do this again if you need to to get it just when you feel yourself smiling the widest at your anticipation of doing this thing.

Now once more to really fine-tune it. Tap exactly when your feelings are strongest. This will stimulate your pineal gland to notice when you need this resource and trigger the appropriate hormonal cascade. See why I suggested being alone? Good. Now forget that until you need it.

Now, this is important. You are going to turn your body into a big switch. This switch is going to allow you to change your state at will from the one where you now find it valuable to be mute with panic to one where you are as confident as you are in brushing your teeth. Ever try brushing your teeth with the opposite hand? Not now, but next time you brush your teeth, try it. Contrast that with doing it with your normal hand. Then realize that at one time it felt just as unnatural with that hand. You gradually did it enough so that now you don't even have to think about it. Your hand just brushes them for you. Pretty handy, huh?

First, without experiencing it, ask your subconscious OUT LOUD to reference a typical experience where you would normally have the behavior that used to trouble you. Ask it to mark that spot and expand it to include any similar experiences that have given you trouble in the past. Also ask it to bring to your conscious attention situations where you would normally have that response, just before you would actually have it. Sort of a courtesy call. Then thank it. OUT LOUD! It may help to treat your subconscious as if it were another person entirely.

Whether or not that's true doesn't matter. It is just a useful way of thinking about it. As is all this stuff.

Now, take a deep breath from the belly. Use your diaphram to pull air down into your lungs into your gut. Try to let your ribs just remain as motionless as possible. OK. Think of something you do without thinking about it. Something you just decide to do and your body goes ahead and does it for you. Driving, walking, whatever. It isn't important what it is as long as its easy and mindless. Ask your subconscious, again out loud, to use this as the target state for your switch. Remember what it feels like to do this mindless thing and maybe even hum to yourself while you do it in your mind.

OK. Building the switch. Its already built! It is your body. You have already defined the two states you will be switching. All you have to do to change from one state to the other is to make one complete 360 degree revolution. It doesn't matter which direction you turn. But it has to be a full circle. And it has to be rapid enough to affect your inner ear where your sense of balance resides. It needn't be smooth or obvious.

You could do it in two quick steps if you wanted. For instance, if you are in a grocery store, you could turn to a shelf and pick up a can of something and then turn back to your cart the same direction to complete the circle. Just do it rapidly enough so that you feel a little bit of dis-equalibrium at the completion. This triggers the state change. Your task will be to do this impeccably so that your intended new friend doesn't think you are a bizarro. You will be able to pull it off if you concentrate on that.

How will you know when to do this? Well, its easy if you are going into a bar or something for the express purpose of meeting someone. Although there are much better places, if you ask me. But your subconscious will give you that courtesy nod when the time is right, if you are not thinking about it expressly. First thing to do if you are putting yourself into a situation consciously for the purpose of meeting a woman, is to tap your forehead just like you learned. You will feel the change in your body and part of it will be that old feeling you used to have when you were about to panic. But the other part will be the hormone cascade you trigger. This will allow you to feel excited instead of fearful. Physiologically the states are almost identical anyway. The small shift will alter it in a helpful direction. If you just realize from a subconscious nudge that you are going into that situation and choose to let yourself, go ahead and do the tap then. You will feel yourself ramp up to get you ready.

Now you have to do the hard part. You have to make your turn. It can be as creative as you want. I have used getting out of the way of a waitress or stepping aside for someone as a nice cover movement, in crowded situations. You can even do it while you are walking over to meet her this way and it seems very natural to you to do this this way now. Did you see the first Superman movie? Remember when Clark Kent gets all excited because he sees a situation calling for His other self? He turns to a phone booth and does a double-take. It is one of those modern ones with no concealment whatsoever. He doesn't let that hesitation stop him though. He just spins at super-speed and makes his change. You do that too. Except when you emerge from your turn you will be......Nonchalant Man! Champion of the comfortable and normal situation. Your powers of Super-casual competence will be astounding!

Practice your turns a few times here until it *clicks*.

Seriously though....Although you may still feel the effects of your tap, you will easily be able to distinguish them from the state you are in where you have a mindless ability to meet someone without anxiety much like your hand knows how to brush your teeth without trying. You will be amazed at the difference and delighted to watch all this from a new perspective.

So, lets review. First, observe. Then tap. Or if your subconscious brings it to your attention that someone is already interested in you before you notice, then tap. Next, turn your switch, changing your state. Observe yourself some here too so that it can become more integrated into your model and eventually the whole shebang will be as unconscious as walking. Then smile and look right into her eyes. Say anything. Enjoy your new friend.

Now for homework...there's always homework isn't there? Just practice the smiling part. Don't do any turns or try to meet anyone for real.

Just practice by picking eleven women at random and meeting their eyes and saying hello. Don't choose all the same type of women or even all women you are attracted to. You aren't going to really meet them anyway.

If you do see someone who is drop dead gorgeous, make it a point to do her. There is no risk because you are only practicing.

Each day for a week do the practice. Each day pay attention to a different aspect of yourself while you practice. Maybe consciously relax all your muscles each time before saying it, on one day. The next day maybe paying attention to your own reaction to her reaction. It doesn't matter what her reaction is. It matters what YOUR reaction is. You aren't meeting these practice women. I think you will find most of them smile back though. Just pick one thing about saying hi to pay attention to each day, eleven times.

Do write back to the news group and tell us about your experiences. If it was important enough for you to ask for help, it should be important enough to tell us how you are doing. I know this is going to be a new and different thing for you in some ways. In others it will be as familiar as getting dressed in the morning. be well. Warmest Regards, Thomas.

Subject: "I AM NOT A CROOK" by Trick Dick Ross Jefferies aka Paul Ross

From: "R. Don Steele" [John White]<donsteel@pac.gte.net>

Date: 1997/05/17

R. DON STEELE’S RESPONSE TO PAUL ROSS’ RANTINGS

Steele, author of "HOW TO DATE YOUNG WOMEN: FOR MEN OVER 35" branded your Guru and Master a fraud! "I've got $5000 to put up when you are ready to accept a public challenge. Just you and me if you want, mano-y-mano in a pick-up girls contest. Since you say I couldn't get laid on Sunset, let's have a neutral third party pick a place and we have a hidden camera follow us both. Whoever gets the most dates/phone numbers in 3 hours gets $5000 from the loser. Are you ready to put your money where your mouth is, you aging, pussy peckerwood, or area you all just hot air?"

SUBJECT: SCARED?

You insulted my Guru Ross Jeffries. For you to say he's a fraud and that he couldn't get laid on Sunset Blvd. makes it clear to me you've never listen to or read his material. So if you really believe what you said then accept his challenge of a $5000 bet on who can pick up the most women. Or are you too much of a pussy to come out and face him. Back up what you say or keep your mouth shut!

Damon Cart p.s. He asked me to tell you that you're a lying pussy and you're to chicken shit to face him.

FROM DON STEELE

I live in paradise, you twit. As to am I scared? Yes, I am terrified that an ugly, tall, skinny geek like Paul Ross might get the best of me in anything. I think I'll stay in “hiding” and let the lonely, socially inept men he defrauds keep Ross in the pink with their cash. For your info, here's what I actually say about Paul Ross in the 10th printing of

HOW TO DATE YOUNG WOMEN.

RECOMMENDED BOOKS

Guys constantly ask if there are any other good books on dating.

They often mention Ross Jefferies. My reply: If you've seen him, a homely, skinny geek, you've got to know he's a fraud! If you haven't seen him, he's a fast-talking swindler who victimizes lonely, socially inept men. He promises them his $3000 seminar will get them laid. Paul Ross, his real name, has a “sure fire course” that's nothing. Used car sales talk and psychobabble stolen from Anthony Robbins, the informercial parasite who promises powerless people he will make them powerful. Ross apparently spent thousands on Robbins' bullshit seminars-tapes-books and is still powerless, as you will soon see!

From '89-94 Ross praised my book, selling 500 a year. Back then, he'd call from time to time and ask how to talk with a young waitress that he'd met or what he had done wrong at a party. I'd run through the fundamentals, one more time. Later on, he called bragging that two young women were living with him for free. He wanted to know how to seduce them! I explained, much to his amazement, that the girls were using him, thus impossible. As always, the desperation oozing from him wasoverpowering.

I was also getting extremely dishonest, read criminal fraud, vibes from him the way he scornfully mocked his students. It became obvious that it would only be a matter of time until he was sued by the guys he had duped. So, from then on, when he called for advice, I secretly recorded our conversations.

In '94 Ross heard my AUDIO TAPE SET on which I expose him as a phony. He instantly he quit selling my book, costing himself about $6,000 a year. Brilliant!

A magazine article sent by one of my fans exposes Ross as a gun nut with a small armory! PSYCHOLOGY 101: Impotent men want a replacement for their flaccid putz. Powerless men want to feel powerful. Guns are inadequate substitutes for inadequate men. Gentlemen, Ross is a loser who couldn't get laid on Sunset.

There's only one book on dating I've ever seen that's worth a damn, The Art Of Flirting, Jillson. I only agree with half. The part that's bullshit will be obvious.

SINCE YOU’RE ALSO A ROSS STOOGE, HERE’S A GENERIC LETTER TO YOU ALL:

Why do you stooges try to convince me? WHY TRY TO CONVINCE ME? THINKABOUT THAT.

Please note, Ross is not a competitor. He’s in the business of blowing smoke up the asses of desperate, lonely men, then removing their wallets.

Whereas, I am in the business of clearly explaining what guys really must do to persuade a young woman to date them.

If you’re still believers, the next time you’re face to face with Ross, ask if he’d like a tape of ME COUNSELING HIM to play for his “students.”

After watching his reaction, should you still believe in the God of NLP, you automatically qualify for the membership in the church of the True Believers, headed by the resurrected Jim Jones and David Koresh.

SOCIAL APTITUDE AND THE MEN PAUL ROSS DEFRAUDS

Immigrants to our great country have a hard time quickly learning just how we do things here. Men who grew up in a home where their parents were neurotic, or worse, have a difficult time mastering the basics of social interaction. And, for men who are shy by birth, it takes more time, patience and courage to build up the confidence needed for social intercourse. Thus, men in these categories have a difficult time meeting their natural, normal needs for human fellowship and female companionship.

I have nothing against any of the lonely, socially inept guys who fall for Paul Ross’ bull. If you have tried everything and nothing has worked, then you’ll listen to a fast-talking, fast-buck artist who promises he can help. When he promises he will get your natural, normal human needs for touching and sex met for only $3000, it probably seems like a bargain.

At “free introductory lessons,” or some such event, I’m certain, that Ross, like his colleagues in fraud, TV Evangelists, brings out a band of “happy customers” who sing his praises and swear by his methods.

The new men are probably made to feel like they are about to become part of something, most likely a “secret” fraternity. (Remember est?)

I understand why some men would want to try his system. But to promise that spewing a bunch of inane hypno-psychobabble at a woman you just met is not a system, it’s fraud.

As to why don’t the men he swindles sue him? Men, by nature, hate to admit they made any mistake, even something simple. Thus, they would never, ever admit they were stupid enough to be swindled out of $3000! by anyone, let alone a loser like Ross.

FROM: ROSS JEFFRIES WHEN WILL YOU EXCEPT MY CHALLENGE, DICKLESS?

FROM DON STEELE Aloha and Love from Paradise,

Nice to hear from you. Howzit there in OJ land? Well, Paul, babe, you're more than welcome to come and visit me here in the tropics now that you're in the money. As to a pick up contest, certainly. How 'bout Alii Drive, in front of Kona Amigos, Saturday night, any Saturday night.

You'll look great in that black outfit. Can't miss with the babes? Eh?

Kisses and Love my friend. Please have more of your "students" write and e-mail me. Some end up buying several items after reading the xeroxes of the shameful, but self-revealing, letters you've written. As a courtesy to you, I'll also include, free, a copy of our phone conversations wherein you reveal yourself to be the fraud that you are. Go for it.

FROM: ROSS JEFFRIES

I TAKE IT THAT YOU ARE SERIOUSLY ACCEPTING THIS CHALLENGE; IF SO, EMAIL BACK YOUR CONFIRMATION. I WILL CONTACT A FEW MEN'S MAGAZINES TO SEE WHO WANTS TO REFEREE, ACT AS ESCROW FOR THE MONEY AND SELECT THE LOCATION, COCKSUCK.

As a courtesy to you, I'll also include, free, a copy of our phone conversations wherein you reveal yourself to be the fraud that you are.

Go for it.

IN YOUR FANTASIES, ASS-WIPE. DO YOU HAVE ANY ABILITY TO RECOGNIZE TRUTH...AND BY THE WAY, THANKS FOR ADMITTING ONCE AGAIN TO COMMITTING A FELONY. MAYBE WE CAN GET YOU TO COME TO CALIFORNIA WHERE WE CAN BRING YOU UP ON CHARGES.

Paul Ross, his real name,

WELL, AFTER MY DETECTIVE AGENCY BUSTS YOUR DBA IN HAWAII, WE'LL FIND OUT YOUR REAL NAME. R. DON(HARDON) STEELE MY ASS.

has a “sure fire course” that's nothing. Used car sales talk and psychobabble stolen from Anthony Robbins, the informercial parasite who promises powerless people he will make them powerful.

GEE. I'LL HAVE TO FORWARD THIS TO TONY'S LAWYERS OVER AT ROBBINS RESEARCH INTERNATIONAL TO SEE WHAT THEY HAVE TO SAY ABOUT THIS LIBEL.

Ross apparently spent thousands on Robbins' bullshit seminars-tapes-books and is still powerless, as you will soon see!

HA. FOR YOUR INFORMATION, IDIOT, I TRAINED WITH BANDLER, THE GUY WHO CREATED NLP. I'VE NEVER EVEN MET TONY.

I CALLED YOU WHEN I FIRST STARTED SELLING YOUR BOOK TO SEE IF YOU HAD ANY CLUE AS TO WHAT YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT.

THE STUFF ABOUT WAITRESSES AND LIVING WITH TWO WOMEN IS COMPLETE FICTION ON YOUR PART, FULL STOP. I'VE NEVER LIVED WITH TWO WOMEN...EVER.

He wanted to know how to seduce them! I explained, much to his amazement, that the girls were using him, thus impossible. As always, the desperation oozing from him was overpowering.

DON, YOU'VE GOT TO STOP DRINKING THAT CHEAP SHIT. THE DT'S ARE DESTROYING YOUR ABILITY TO DISTINGUISH BETWEEN FACT AND FICTION.

GEE. I'VE GOT 40,000 SATISFIED CUSTOMERS. I'VE NEVER EVEN HAD A CUSTOMER FILE A COMPLAINT AGAINST ME, MUCH LESS BEEN SUED. WHERE ARE YOU MAKING THIS UP FROM, VODKA BREATH? AND ARE YOU AWARE THAT TAPING CONVERSATIONS WITHOUT THE CONSENT OF THE OTHER PARTY IS A FELONY? GEE DON...MAYBE YOU CAN WRITE A BOOK: HOW TO BE THE MOST POPULAR BITCH ON YOUR CELL BLOCK; FOR FELONS OVER 35.

PSYCHOLOGY 101: Impotent men want a replacement for their flaccid putz.

Powerless men want to feel powerful. Guns are inadequate substitutes for inadequate men.

DON'T KNOW WHAT IT'S LIKE IN HAWAII, BUT HERE IN L.A., GUNS ARE NECESSARY FOR SELF-DEFENSE. HELL, MY GIRLFRIEND LOVES GUNS MORE THAN ME AND IS A MUCH BETTER SHOT. ARE YOU AFRAID OF FIREARMS, DON? DON'T BE. LET'S GET TOGETHER AND I'LL SHOW YOU HOW THEY WORK.

Gentlemen, Ross is a loser who couldn't get laid on Sunset.

$5000 SAYS I CAN KICK YOUR ASS IN A PICK-UP GIRLS CONTEST. ONCE AND FOR ALL... THINK OF THE PUBLICITY IF IT'S DONE BY HARD COPY, EXTRA, ETC.

Also, please note, Ross is not a competitor. He’s in the business of blowing smoke up the asses of lonely men, then removing their wallets.

Whereas, I am in the business of clearly explaining what guys really must do to persuade a young woman to date them.

YOU KNOW DON, CAN YOU CERTAINLY SEE SOMETHING IS COMING YOUR WAY?

SOMETHING THAT RUNS IN THE FAMILY? IT CAN EAT AWAY AT YOU WHEN A PERSON TRIES TO FIGURE OUT THE MEANING OF SOMETHING LIKE THIS. WORRY IS A TERRIBLE THING...IT CAN SPREAD THROUGH THE BODY POLITIC OF A NATION, SAPPING ALL STRENGTH.KISSES, SARGY J. CAT!TESTIMONY FROM: JOBET CLAUDIO

I am from the Philippines and I am one of Ross's students. Though I have not personally met the guru, we share an unexplainable rapport with each other. I just want you to know that his technology and the kick-ass tudes that he has imparted to me has changed my life.

Understand that SS is based on a very powerful body of knowledge, which is Neuro-Linguistic Programming. This has literally allowed me to hack around women's minds to get the results I want.

I will not be as gung-ho as the rest of my brothers, and will remain civil in this discourse with you. However, please note that I am highly concerned that you choose to publicly denounce Ross and call people like me morons. Mind you, I am graduating from my MBA at a prestigious school and have been tested to have an IQ of 145.

One last thing...be careful of Ross or any of his students. I myself am perfecting techniques that will link tremendous pain to everyday events in people that I don't like very much.

Ross is much much more powerful than I, and if you continue pissing him off, you could find yourself on the business end of an impotence suggestion, which can only be undone by another NLP practitioner.

PERSUASIVE E-MAIL FROM: <JOE@COMPUPRIZES.COM>

Why don't you take up Ross Jeffries on his offer? Are you scared? Maybe you'll find yourself thinking of the public humiliation you'd suffer at Ross's hands...and as you experience that agony...you might begin to wonder... why you even called him a "fraud" in the first place... and as you picture yourself apologizing to Ross and his dedicated students, you might actually learn something... by grabbing your credit card... and ordering some of Ross's confidence tapes... to prepare you... to get rid of the manipulative cow that you call a girlfriend... and go out and find... that YOU CAN DO BETTER! Peace, Dickface...

TESTIMONIAL FROM MACK RIDDICK

Hello Ross, I'm writing to you to say that speed seduction is brilliant.

I've started seriously studying/applying speed seduction recently with astounding results. I met a young lady on a internet chat room. i started using little chunks of patterns on her (Instaneous connection, time distortion) within 90 minutes of online chatting, she gave me her home phone # and want to speak to me because she felt so comfortable and felt like she's known me a long time. I call her a few days later and run the "instaneous connection" pattern on her in it's entirety and then I read her some poetry (love drops by taylor nabikov). by then she was hooked.

By now she's leaving phone messages and e-mail daily. I respond by e-mailing her poetry loaded with speed seduction languaging every night for several days. At this point she tells me that she fantasizes about me constantly, and dreams about me nightly ,and becomes so aroused that her panties are wet constantly. She 's now wants to visit me in NY. (she lives in California) at her own expense. i would n't have to spend a dime of my own money. She says that she wants me in the worst way, and said that she would ride my cock like the teacups at disneyland.To make a long story short , we exchanged pictures .On March 29th 1997 she flew in to NY from CA . from the moment she got off the plane , she couldn't keep her hands off of me . We spent four days at a local hotel ,with her riding my baloney poney most of the time. Speed Seduction has worked beyond my wildest imagination.This stuff works with any one. I'm not in the best shape physically(in fact i'm very over weight) . I'm not considered handsome (Ross have dubbed me Jabba the Hut) . None of this matters when you use Speed Seduction. In fact very recently I seduced another young woman into giving me oral sex(blowjob pattern). I've become unstoppable. If you want to call me.I'll answer questions about my success or Speed Seduction in general, i'm at (718) 992- 3551 Mack

Riddick aka Jabba the Hut Remember : "THE ULTIMATE PERSUASION , FOR THE LOWER INVASION"TESTIMONY ON SS AND INTERVIEWING FROM ROSS JEFFRIES

TO: DONSTEEL CHOKE ON IT, YOU WORTHLESS FUCK-WAD.From: "Vijay Chakravarthy" <vijay@chem-eng.nwu.edu>

I found some good applications of SS stuff when I went interviewing with companies, and also noticed a few things. First, I was not at all concerned with whether I'd land up the job, and amazingly enough mainly through being focused on the communication I did end up with the job.

Well in fact I had a 100% success rate at interviews. Second, embedded commands work like a charm!! In fact, now most of my structuring of conversations occurs like this - at a subconcious level almost.. First I tend to figure out the target state I want the person to be in. Next step is to construct a sequence of direct commands to get them into that state. Third step is to modify these direct commands so as to put them into a regular conversational framework. This includes quotes, negation etc etc. Also I tend to lean towards metaphor as well. So far this seems to work quite well. I need to learn loops and try out a lot more different methods of analogue marking. Thoughts, comments? Vijay

FROM DON STEELE TO PAUL ROSS:

Paul, as a worthless fuck-wad, I totally choked on it. What can I say?

After that convincing, dare I use the word, potent, testimony, I can no longer doubt that “this very powerful body of knowledge, which is Neuro-Linguistic Programming,” really works. In fact, I’m truly convinced your speed seduction can enable Filipinos to “hack around in women’s minds” as well as making it possible for Indies, or is Vijay a Paki?, to have “a 100% success rate at interviews!”

But whale’s tale was the ultimate clincher! When you had him e-mail me with his testimony, I was persuaded. Nothing will ever make me commit blasphemy again. I mean when an overweight, unattractive guy can just chat on the internet, read some poetry on the phone, then have a female come at her own expense from LA to NYC and wear him out . . . that’s a story that will convince the world as it did me. Publish it on the internet for all to see. The world will be at your feet. A miracle, yes, but also a sure fire method to GET THE WOMAN YOU DESIRE INTO BED. (Maybe Hard Copy! Would actually be interested! Wow!)

To convince you of my sincerity, sign me up for classes taught to immigrants from India, Pakistan, Philippines, Bangladesh and South Korea.

When the Vietnamese seminar is held, I’ll be first in line. After that, I want to begin NLP practitioner training so I can assist you during the course you’re no doubt developing for illegal Mexicans.

I’m sorry from the bottom of my heart. Please accept my heart felt apology. ABOVE ALL! I beg you! Don’t use your voodoo-like powers to put me “on the business end of an impotence suggestion.”

Just in case you do get pissed off and think I’m not sincere, I going to buy a couple of dozen different guns and some swords. That way I’ll have a substitute for my flaccid member until I find “another NLP practitioner” who can undo your powerful curse.

By that time, will Tammy Bakker, Jimmy Swaggart or Oral Roberts be certified NLP practitioners?

If not, give yourself “embedded commands” to express what you think and want without adolescent insults. “Figure out the target state you want to be in” so that you can “picture yourself” as something other than a high school dropout. “Construct a sequence of direct commands” so that you know the difference between accept a challenge and except a challenge.

“On a internet chat room, start using little chunks of patterns (instantaneus connection, time distortion)” so that “within 90 minutes of online chatting,” your life becomes an even larger sinkhole of despair as to the hopelessness of it all.

But it’s safe and secure, isn’t it, being there at your keyboard, not having to be face-o to face-o, mano y woman-o where you could get hurt-o.

You can appear to be brilliant and handsome and witty and clever because nobody can see you as you really are-o.

“Learn loops” as find yourself thinking of “the public humiliation you'll suffer” when everyone reads what you wrote and thus revealed yourself to be the desperate buffoon that you are.

. . . “and as you experience that agony”. . . “you might begin to wonder why you even bothered” announcing to the entire WWW your lack of education, lack of job skills, lack of everything it takes to cut it out here in the real world without deceiving socially inept, lonely men as well as defrauding gullible refugees.

“It can eat away at you when a person tries to figure out the meaning of something like this. Worry is a terrible thing...it can spread through the” NLP believers causing many to say, “Methinks Ross doth protest too much.”

Realize that est-holes got their revenge on the founder of est, Werner Erhart, aka Jack Goldberg, encyclopedia salesman. (You did try selling encyclopedias first, didn’t you!) Goldberg was busted no matter that he, like you, threatened everyone with detectives and fanciful lawsuits. Like you, he promised his victims est was legitimate because his “system” was based on methods developed by fill-in-the-blank famous hypnotists, family therapy, Gestalt, et al. Paul, babe, Goldberg had millions and he went down at the hands of his swindled victims.

“Try out a lot more different methods of analogue marking” as you repent “by grabbing your credit card... and” return the money you swindled.

Picture yourself apologizing to your defrauded “students.”

What’s the problem? Either you are a fraud or you are not. With 40K satisfied customers, what’s to worry. Simply stand up and say, “I am not a crook.” After all, only 45k copies of my HOW TO DATE YOUNG WOMEN exist.

Stay where you belong and nobody, especially me, will ever brand you as a fraud again. Where do you belong? In a PT Barnum sideshow as the parasite you are, counting on Barnum’s most famous dictum, “There’s a sucker born every minute.”

The men you bilked probably don’t realize you also follow Barnum’s axiom on publicity, but I’ll bet they can make this connection:

Your month-long petulant rant about NOT being a fraud. Your, angry, desperate spewing of adolescent insults in a limp attempt to provoke my cooperation in staging something for Hard Copy AND Barnum’s PUBLICITY axiom “I don’t care what you print. Spell my name right, PT Ross, Oops, Paul Ross, Oops, Ross Jefferies.”

Regarding my pen name. It is a take off of “The Real Don Steele,” the DJ so that the name of my company, Steel Balls Press, was easy to associate.

It’s based somewhat on memory techniques taught in $$$$ seminars, often conducted by swindlers! You’d know about that type of operation.

With your pseudo-psych background, I’m sure you know that one can’t help but reveal himself when he writes, no matter it if it’s a novel or inane e-mail. With that stated, the only other person in the last ten years who associated “R. Don” with “hard on” was my second wife’s openly gay cousin. Hummm!?

Your orientation is of no consequence to me, but that might explain a lot of things, in particular, that small armory of yours! You know, it also might sort of flesh out, pun intended, everyone’s understanding that unusual, pubescent preoccupation you have with other men’s sexual behavior.

“Are you scared?” You should be. Shooting one’s foot, or rather, feet again and again causes death, slow agonizing death from self-inflicted stupidity.

I am becoming very, very sleepy, yes sleepy, yes, I will be sorry I ever called you a fraud. OOPS, drifted off because of that strong, suggestive writing by your “students.”Aloha Oe, (Farewell to thee) Don

P.S. The following is offered in a humanistic gesture as an alternative to your present course of self destruction.

Being a laughed at and picked on in high school is painful, yes.

Being lonely all your adult life is terrible, yes. Being rejected over and over and over by girls, then women is hurtful and humiliating.

But, becoming a manipulative phony is not the way to respond. You only strengthen those painful childhood traumas and reinforce your revengeful adolescent view of other human beings.

It’s time to stop being plastic. It’s time to start treating other people as you would like to be treated. You must go first. You must risk. You must reach out. You must be real. But you must go first.

Other human beings are humans, not things to control and dominate.

You, alone, must decide if you want to use and manipulate or cooperate and celebrate.

Courage is the virtue that makes all other virtues possible. It will take courage to risk. Have courage!

Angst, that constant dread you feel, will begin to melt away when you no longer fear being discovered as a manipulative phony because you will have become real and sincere.

Genuine self esteem will follow. Life will become a joy. People will become pleasurable, not something to defend against, fight against.

SUGGESTION FOR STEP ONE: Most therapists know that salesmen are the most frightened people on the planet. Thus, when, as a salesman, you attempt to sell NLP to real people and worse, actual salesmen, you are terrified.

In short, find another way of paying the rent. Do something where you don’t have to fear being rejected all the time when people realize you are not genuine. Do something where you can be yourself, as you are, whatever you are.

Courage!R. Don Steele [John White], Steel Balls Press

Realistic, practical and genuinely helpful books for men and women

http://steelballs.com

Jamie: "Just because Ross DIDN'T have the skills to meet women WHEN he was working for Steele, does not mean that SS does not work.

"In fact, most (successful) people in life actually go on and work hardest at those areas they are 'weakest' in when they are young. They develop strategies to get what they want - which is often conquering their'weakness'.

"Abe Lincoln could not look at anyone in the eye when he was a teenager, let alone speak in public. He went on, of course, to become one of the world's most accomplished orators.

"Who would make a better teacher than someone who had to learn something themselves, the hard way and from scratch?"

RAY: "I have learned more from my many failures with women than from my successes. Sometimes I have struck out almost on purpose just to see how the destruction mechanism works. Other times I have repelled women I did not want attracted to me, or just to see how they act when they are stuck-up. I've gone online as short men, tall men (which I am), rich men (which I've been), poor men (which I am sometimes), artists, musicians, surfers, and just about every type of person imaginable. I've also gone online as women, and found that men are pretty DUMB in the way they approach them. This is what a thorough researcher does.

"If you asked me five years ago how to seduce women, my answers would have been much more simplistic and uncreative than they are now. Smart people grow over time, especially when they are committed to that growth. Ross is a very smart man in his understanding of women. That doesn't mean he was always that way, and the past really doesn't matter. I still will never forget the ONE time I tried SS on a woman and had her groping me on the dance floor within an hour. It was scary how powerful it was. But it was fake and not the way I choose to operate. I have been seeking a method of SS that is not dishonest, and have found a few. In fact, I published a wrinkle to SS that makes it less dishonest, and the woman literally winds up asking you to use it on her. That removes the lack of consent issue right there.

"Let me also point out the power of talking to one woman about your power over OTHER women. Men should know this by their own reactions to women who inject other men into their conversations. My ultimate goal -- a seduction book that men can read from while they are seducing a woman -- is still far off but it's not impossible. The idea is to have the book contain responses to everything the woman is likely to say. Something like this:

SHE: "That book would never work on me!"HE (turning to page 18): "Read this."

On page 18 is a treatise entitled "So you think this book won't work on you? Think again, hon." Then it explains why she is reading the page, how she reacts, etc.

"There is a basic premise to my theory of seduction: Women hate to argue, and they hate to lose. Actually women LOVE to argue EXCEPT when they lose. A woman who is losing an argument will eventually want to win, and if she runs out of ideas the only way to do it is with sexuality. The man gets sex, the woman wins the argument, and everyone is happy.

"Another problem I have with SS is that I would not want to bed a woman that could not see through the technique, so that alone invalidates it for me.

Subject: Re: R. Don Lives!From: david1229@aol.com (David1229)

Date: 1998/04/17

Message-ID: <1998041700205500.UAA19024@ladder01.news.aol.com>

Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast[Subscribe to alt.seduction.fast] [More Headers]

> peter berkhof <bag-import@wxs.nl> wrote:

>Women do not need men who need to learn how to treat women.

***************************************************

Women are trying to learn how to treat men. Just take a look at the front cover of any issue of Cosmopolitan. It is filled with articles advising women how to relate to men.

>Because when i"m surfing the net, i need the have look in this dark corner to >get a>good laugh.

***************************************************

Funny, I don't hear you laughing. I hear a pathetic lonely loser (probably a virgin) trying to lord it over others in the only arena he can possibly do so.

>When i read the postings, i am really having fun, thinking tonight I'll just>do >what you all are trying to get under control.

***************************************************

I guess you think we are trying to get mastubation under control.

>The difference is, that i learned it by socializing with women.

I think everyone here agrees that one has to get out there and socialize with women. Even Ross Jeffries, the creator of Speed Seduction, says that you have to get out there and talk to women and practice. And R. Don, whose name is immortalized in the title of this thread says the same thing in his book How To Date Young Women. If you think that anyone here believes they can learn to relate to women without getting out there, talking to women, and learning from our mistakes, then you are a fool. You are arguing with a point of view which no one here maintains.

>I just went to the battlefield and learnt my opponent from the inside out.

***************************************************

Love is not a battlefield and women are not the opponent. They too are trying to figure out how to make relationships work. Even after one is married all the answers do not materialize. There will always be more to learn until the you die. And the fact that you see women as the opponent demonstrates to me that you have MUCH to learn.

>You all are cowards and think you can learn it any other >You have to be a man and find out

***************************************************

A man is simply an adult human being with a Y chromosone.

>and find out by yourself,

***************************************************

There is no room for advice? If you cannot learn from someone elses mistakes than you will be forced to make the same ones. Only a fool stubbornly refuses to learn by example.

>that is written by so-called>expert is old news.

***************************************************

I haven't heard any NEW ideas from you. And all news is old news because it has already happened. But I don't have to put my hand into fire to learn that it will burn. I can learn by precept and example as well as experience. That is because I have intelligence.

>Just be a man and not a pussy.

***************************************************

I am a man, as proven by my chromosones. And all you are good at is calling names. If you were really busy getting laid, you would not have the level of frustration and anger which you demonstrate here. So continue on posting your boastful lies and insults here, Love Guru. You and I both know that you are a phony, a fraud, a pathetic, sad, angry, frustrated little virgin who has nothing positive in his life.

>By the way, how many languages do you speak?

***************************************************

That is no measure of intelligence. I'll compare I.Q.s with you anyday. The reason most americans are monolingual is not lack of intelligence but lack of need for a foreign language. America is a vast empire compared to the puny states of Europe. By the way, we didn't need more than a handful of foreign phases to save your butts from Hitler during WWII.

Subject: Re: R. Don Lives!

From: jlking3@ix.netcom.com (James L. King III)Date: 1998/04/16

Message-ID: <jlking3-1504982212300001@cha-nc5-13.ix.netcom.com>

Newsgroups: alt.seduction.fast[Subscribe to alt.seduction.fast] [More Headers]

> Thoughout my life the lion's share of my women have tried > to seduce me and spent their energies on pleasing me.

> Was I using speed seduction? Of course not, > there ain't no such animal. Oddly enough, the poor souls > in this group are trying to be me. Well if I knew this > years ago, I could be as rich as Ross by now.> > Luck Fellows,> Joseph

Joseph, first of all, congratulations on your success with women. I'm sure that I would have been envying you during younger days not-so-long-ago.

I don't know who you are, therefore, I can't try to be YOU on purpose.

Neither would I want to be.

You see, I enjoy being ME ... but at the same time, I am always looking for avenues to improve myself. Whether it's taking more classes at the local community college in my spare time, browsing newsgroups on the internet, going to the library to read about a particular topic, or listening to the news on the radio, I am continually striving to learn as much as I can during this short life I have here.

My foray into self-improvement led me to a discovery of a book called "Instant Rapport" by Michael Brooks, a book that introduced me to NLP.

I had studying hypnosis before, and have used self-hypnosis successfully for some avenues in my life, although not to the level I wished. NLP and the way it uses language gave me that boost I needed. In fact, many times I could do away with the traditional trance-inducing methods I was using and just use the language itself to begin to change my behavior patterns.

During my studies of NLP, I ran across Ross Jeffries' materials. I decided to look at them, and discovered that his approach takes the "attitude" that Psychiatrist David Burns discusses in "Intimate Connections" and adds the languaging of NLP to create something quite different and more powerful than Burn's book, which was usually my first choice of a self-help book when it came to relationships.

Applying the knowledge I gained from Ross, other NLP books, Intimate Connections, and another good relationship book called "Love Tactics," I came to a personal plan of action and philosophy regarding women.

To say that there isn't such an animal as speed seduction is false, because even if Ross didn't teach it, Speed Seduction would be happening in the world somewhere now. Apparently, you are able to do it naturally without having to have had a course in it, just like some people are able to play musical instruments with very little training. There are people who through their experiences have developed attitudes and language skills very similar to Ross'. I have a good friend who has never heard of Ross Jeffries until last week, yet when I would see him meeting a new woman, I would hear many of the embeds and languaging that Ross helps his students develop. I knew from the beginning that he had this "take no shit" attitude but yet he is genuinely concerned with making these women feel very accepted, understood, and appreciated.

I asked him where he learned that from, and he said he just discovered what works as he went along.

If my friend can do it "naturally," then I can learn to do it with some degree of skill, too. I wish you well, Lee.

San Francisco Chronicle

June 7, 1999

WAR OF THE PICKUP ARTISTS: The Speed Seduction guru versus Steelballs sounds more like the titillating title of an NC-17 movie than the nicknames for combatants in a libel lawsuit with implications for the Internet.

Paul Ross, aka Ross Jefferies -- whose Web site, newsletter and seminars promote a behavioral approach to picking up women called "speed seduction" -- is suing R. Don Steele, aka John J. White, whose Steelballs Web site hawks books such as "How to Date Younger Women," "Sexpectations" and "How to Dump Your Wife."

The suit, filed in late April in Los Angeles County Superior Court, alleges that White called rival Ross a "fraud, ex-felon, crack addict and psychotic" among other things in numerous online postings since March 1997. It seeks unspecified damages and a restraining order.

White claims that Ross is attempting to "chill" his free speech. "I guess you can call it a classic Internet pissing match," said San Francisco attorney Karl Olson, who represents White. Ross' attorney, William E. Harris of Brentwood, said White has attacked Ross online for two years.

At one point, Steelballs allegedly broke into a private newsgroup on Ross' Web site and libeled him. He then posted that confrontation on his own commercial home page. "The guy wants to ruin Ross like a company would put a rival out of business with vicious rumors and distorted ads," Harris said. "This is a case about how far you can go with freedom of speech. The constitution doesn't protect libel -- especially on the World Wide Web."

White said he is merely trying to expose Ross, whom he repeatedly called a "thief and crook" in a phone interview last week.