Wednesday, July 4th, 2001

Too Young For Porno

Ridley99 writes: Luke i want your opinion on a topic that is burning up the message boards on RAME. is an 18 year old GIRL emotional stable enougfh to handle the physical and emotional rigors of the porn shoots of today.

Is an 18 year old girl wise and experienced enough to enter the porn industry. The Chasey Lain tradgedy has me very troubled, this beautiful girl who literraly if the breaks had fallen th3e other way could have been a fashion modelhas been turned into a mindkless crack whore, her age when she entered porn cannot have been too long past 18.

I feel a girl should be at least 21 before entering this seedy profession. I also feel girls under 21 should be tested for drugs before film shoots. I also feel there should be an Orientation for girls entering porn. where they are told the diferrences bvetween Gonzo and Vivid. the difference between Paul Thomas and Max Hardcore.

I feel now, that i am enabling these sick bastards, as they emotional destroy these 18 year olds, and i just can't stay silent any longer. the recent boom of the barely legal series and thier more violent kin has produced a hunt for 18 year old that the industry has never seen before, it also has suitcase pimps running to kick thier Naive girlfriends into the bizness, lifes are going to be ruined unless somebody does something and something fast. most girls enter porn thinking they will be the next Jenna Jameson chatting it up with Howard Stern or visting the Cannes fil feastival as an E correspondent. most will end up like Chasey Lain OR WORSE.

MikeSouth.com writes: Hey Luke, just wanted to answer that guys questions about 18 year olds in porn.

To tag an age in years on when some girl is ready to enter porn is a poor solution indeed. The age of majority in this country has been determined to be 18 years of age. So that's the drop dead minimum, one that I firmly support.

But to think that a girl or a guy is ready to make that decision just because he or she lived long enough to reach that age is just as ludicrous as saying he/she isn't. I feel that I have a responsibility to myself to interview each girl I shoot carefully, I have shot 18 year olds who were very well emotionally equipped to make this decision and I have refused to shoot 35 year old girls who absolutely were not equipped to make this decision. In the end I have to make the choice based on whether I feel the girl knows what she is doing and why I think she is doing it. I won't shoot a girl who is just looking for a quick fix to a financial problem that is going to return in 30 or 60 days, I won't shoot her if I believe someone is pushing her into it. I won't shoot her if I think she is doing it to support a drug habit or a wannabe rock star boyfriend.

Getting back to the topic at hand, to blame Chasey's problems on entering porn at a young age is to deny what the problem really is. Chasey would most likely be a junkie whether porn was ever a part of her life or not, the only difference would be that Ridley99 wouldn't know about it.

I am not saying that porn can't f--- up someones life, it can but it does not discriminate as to what age, maturity is the real deciding factor. If there were some valid way to measure and rate someones maturity I would support that over an age minimum but there isn't so I work with what I have.

JRob writes: I disagree with Ridley99 (or at least the premise) on different grounds. A similar issue should have been raised during the recent flap over Jenna Bush having a drink.

I am entirely against partially disenfranchising citizens. If the consensus of the nation is that the legal age should be 21 (or 25 or 30), then so be it. But, as the age of majority is 18, then everything associated with that status should be available. If a person is old enough to die in the military, be responsible for the contracts he or she signs, and be responsible for his criminal acts as an adult, he or she should also get all the benefits (and take responsibility for the negative consequences [if any] for exploring those benefits).

An 18 year old gets to vote, get a credit card, go to prison, shoot an M16 at various wogs, and pay child support. She / He should also be allowed to get incredibly drunk and 1. Vote for Jesse Ventura, 2. Buy $5,000 worth of crap with his / her first credit card with no ability to pay the bill, 3. Be bent over a sink by hardened convicts, 4. Join the army after a binge and wonder how the hell it happened, 5. Wake up next to a skank who is pregnant / has been impregnated after a night of drunken debauchery, and 6. STAR IN A BUKKAKE FEATURE THREE DAYS AFTER HER EIGHTEENTH BIRTHDAY.

If citizens are too young to drink booze and gallons of semen, then they are too young for all of the other rights and responsibilities of citizenship. If a person is old enough for the rights and responsibilities of citizenship, then he / she is old enough to buy a bottle of Bull Ice and get gangbanged in front of a camera.

Satyric writes: While I think Ridley99 is being a little hyperbolic in some of his arguments, I applaud him for voicing concerns about this matter. I've rented and jerked off to my fair share of "barely legal" and "18 and nasty" porn so maybe I'm being a little hypocritical but I do think the age could be upped to 19. I think 21 is unrealistic and Mike South's point of certain 35 year olds not being mature enough to be in porn while some 18 year olds can handle it fine is certainly valid. But one more year of growth and maturity before deciding to make a life changing decision about having sex on film does make sense to me.

However this is NOT something I want mandated by the lousy government. I know it won't happen but if the porn companies could all agree they will only use people 19 and over I would have no problem with it. But what they could do for sure is have an Orientation similar to what Ridley speaks of for woman of all ages entering porn. That absolutely should be required.

Heather Barron's Desperate Appeal To East Coast Whoremongers

From heatherbarronxxx.com: Ok, so I tons and tons of email from NY, Boston and Detroit, saying HB come to town...so I book flights, hotels, etc and then I get 1 booking for NY, 2 bookings for Boston and none for Detroit. So at this rate, I'll be refunding those 2 deposits (one gents gonna fly here to see me, luv ya sweety...so that trip is cancelled unless I get more Boston bookings by 7/02). If you take a look at Eros, there are about 100 girls in NY this month, all porn stars, so market must be flooded with boobies. I'm still hopeful on Detroit. So I'm gonna be in LA all of July!

Luke Gets Mail

Ari writes: Luke, I was looking at nycfantasies.com that you wrote about, and I checked out the rates page NYC Fantasies . Now you can see that Teri Weigel is the most expensive at $2,500 for an hour, but you can get adorable, sweet hottie Gauge for only $1,200! Now what fool would pay $2,500 for Teri when you can get "2 Gauges for the price of 1 Teri"? And have $100 left over to donate to a local Shul or Chabad house.

From XXX: I hear that Raylene is hanging out with Eric Erlandsen from Hole, they're working on music together. Don't know if he's dating her.

Rob writes: Would you happen to know who reps a starlet named Jade Marcella or how I might contact her? I'm developing a non-hardcore video project and would like to discuss it with her.

Roy Garcia from SSTM.net writes: Luke, I read your site everyday religiously. Most of the slaughtering of the English Language done by a few overly praised sex workers is entertaining at best, in a boring - porno kind of way. But, lately the s--- has hit the fan in a 4rth of July sort of way! If you started a pay site tomorrow, I'd be your first member. But since it's a free forum, I have decided to put my 2 cents worth in...

Patrick Riley - you rock! You like all my finds.
Jenna Jameson - You double Rock, your posts are graceful and professional no matter what the temperate climate is. Every model that I scout has heard of you and your site www.clubjenna.com
Fight Fans - Assault is illegal, it is always the better man (Jay) that walks away.
David Moore- At first I didn't like you, now I just think that a vacation is in order for you. Relax man, have some fun, wear a flowered shirt, take a producer to Spagos - this is show biz!
Kid Vegas - Glad you got sober.
Quasarman - You beat Regan Senter as the funniest person in Adult!
Porn Fans - Can you believe that these people actually have sex with each other after all of the bickering?
My Opponents - if you don't know me, and I don't know you... what you say about me behind my back could never remotely resemble the truth. And, if you don't like the girls that I find... you are gay!!! Keep up the great work ... er, Drama Luke

BT writes: Dear Luke: Isn't this pissing contest between Jenna, her boyfriend, and this other guy getting a bit tedious.

They're all posturing as if in the real world they're going to actually beat, smack down, and shoot one another .... give me a break. It's like two pro football players trash talking on the field while covered from head to toe in gear -- even if one of them hits the other, they're not going to do any real damage.

And Jenna talking about the eight years she's spent getting herself to the point where she is today -- give me break redeux. Jenna needs to remember that the shelf life of your average porn princess is about 8 months, which means she's been damn lucky to extend her run by about 7 extra years.

She's been fun to watch but all good things will pass, including this. She might consider that porn is about illusion -- the illusion that girls who look like the girl next door, or maybe hotter, are beautiful fantasy chicks just dying to drop their drawers for us.

Every time she opens her mouth, or writes something on your site, she blows the illusion -- the real Jenna, personality wise, just isn't as attractive as the illusion. Never let us see the man behind the curtain, Jenna. She's at the top of her game now, but when it slides -- and it will -- it'll slide fast.

There's only two women I can think of who have been able to successfully extend their careers -- and that's Ginger and Marilyn, and while I'm a huge fan of both, they're audience is not as broad-based as it once was. In a year or two, Jenna's gonna be having this same pissing contest, but from the home for ex-porn stars and no one will care.

They'd all be better served by thinking about the fans and how to provide them with entertainment while the good times are still rolling for Jenna.

BrandyAlx1: Meni probably didn't get dumped by Weakest Link just because he is in adult, but because deep down he is ashamed of what he does and didn't put on the application what he does for a living. Then went ahead and signed it saying everything was true and corrected to the best of his knowledge. I'm sure that's exactly what the show would tell you if you called.

Meni writes: Luke, you f---in' clown I made up the 'Weakest Link' story to show you print ANYf---INTHING haa haa I love you clown boy.

A Good Week For l-keford.com

Gregory Bowman writes: Luke: Your website looks like a WWF grudge match: you have:

The fat internet kid going after the biggest name in porn.

You have two female pimps fighting over women.

You have an egotard agent Moore pissing everyone off.

Jimmy Di Giorgio has given up sex.

And you have Mike Vs Brooke- a real ass pounder.

You have a sprinkling of Mob AND Luke against the Orthodoxy of the Jewish Religion. This is better than Ringling Bros.

Joseph Elkind Says No More Internexts

Webmaster Joseph Elkind owned part of the IA2000 internet show which was sold to AVN and became Internext, the most important of the porn webmaster trade shows.

Joe now publishes the monthly magazine Klixxx which is devoted to the porn internet.

Elkind competes with Paul Fishbein's Adult Video News and its monthly magazine AVNOnline. Joe claims Fishbein wouldn't shake his hand at Internext.

Klixxx magazine's layouts, rates and ad card seem to be a direct copy of its older and more established AVN competitor.

Known as "JoeE" within the industry, Elkind writes on Netpond:

Internext Costs:

Advertisment: $5,380
Airfare : $8,140.50
Banners : $21,637.46
Booth : $115,240.27
Business Meals:$378.75
Expense Checks:$10,925
Parties :$43,651
Hotel : $48,567.55
Printing : $3,159.86
Transportation : $398
T-Shirts :$3,778.90
Total: $261,258.17

Thanks Internext............ This does not include any misc costs and the 3 limo busses shared with CEN, SmutCash and Silvercash;-))))) Plus I dropped $40K out of my pocket.... F*ck Vegas....

Webmasters let's get together without spending all these overheads and I can pay $60 @ SignUp! Netmanagement (managers for CEN, SexCheck, Emailbucks, Klixxx, etc) will not participate in Internext anymore.

Paul would not even shake my hand and that pisses me off. Without CE, CEN, ARS, Maxcash, Igallery, Python, Silvercash, Babenet,etc.. THERE WOULD BE NO SHOW!

CEN is pulling and I am sure Igallery is also..total waste of money.. Fly to my house and I will have poker games and girls and traffic deals and content;-))))) See ya'll in Miami.. We do have a booth for fay's show and will be throwing a FREE party at Solid Gold North miami;-))) Who cares? We do! ;-)))

PS- Last year January Vegas we spent $400K! Have a happy 4th!

Mike@SilverCash.com writes: JoeE...I'm with ya.. f--- Vegas..I'm sick of going there over and over again. We too dropped well over $200G's at the show...

AlienX@SinCityFilms.com writes that Sin City spent $12k at the show.

Brad Shaw writes: "I recall hearing CE spent over $1million for a show. Seems like overkill to me. I think we spent about $100k on this last show, which I consider a good investment from the content deals we closed at the show, or will close over the next 2 weeks from the show."

JoeE writes on Netpond: Ask him Luke! I had to grab his [Paul's] hand and make him shake it in front of witnesses...And never doubt me;-))))

Luke ..read the articles in both magazines and maybe THEN you can make a distinction between the 2 medium. Klixxx is geared towards "how to make money on the net". That's what I (we) have been doing since 1996...what experience do they have? NEXT;-)))

Luke- I know more than you behind the scenes bro! Private(PRVT-nasdaq) is completely pissed that they are doing 2 shows in January.. WHY? Webmasters have to pay for his breakup! Next! And yeah I am pissed... freaken' CE had a banner as their booth, everybody is digging into our margins...Webmasters want cash, not Vegas!

Serge Birbrair writes to JoeE: You were not making money on the net in 1996. You were barely making money in 1996, not enough to pay for bandwidth and had to chase poor ISP on the parking lot with your car in the begining of 1996.

In March of 1997 you met Serge who blessed Florida with his visit in his beaten up station wagon and who opened your eyes and POCKET to the magic of RECURRING BILLING! By 1998 you were almost in the Big League and now you are a Big Kahoona! You were not anywhere near to in 1996!

AlienX@SinCityFilms.com writes Luke: Ya might be wondering why I have not writtin ya in so long, well ya made me mad sorta. I suppose now at this point I am over it. So I am gonna come out and comment on the KLIXXX VS. AVN thing that has been thrown up in the midst along with a the new chaos and especially acute drama. I mean why the f--- not, everyone else got something to say about this that and the other, however the KLIXXX, AVN thing is the biggest of em all. f--- tit for tat we may be witnessing the beginning of two giants square off for market share.

We are at a key point now where I think the web is/has dwarfed adult video production. Keep in mind thats just my opinion. The Net plays the most important role now in selling titles, providing detail's and f---en everything else under the sun to put it basically for the fans of adult. AVN provides a wide spectra of info that address consumer and producer in a vague all in one manor. Thus making it somewhat handy, especially if it is nearly the only one available. AVN's bread and butter I feel would be AVN's coverage of movie releases and reviews followed with industry detail's on talent and Audio text of course as well.

AVN is a trade Magazine for the adult video industry and I think it has evolved beutifully to observe the web in good detail as well. AVN is good in my book but it is impossible to cover it all. As of late many can and have disputed AVN over a long range of things, and the tape that runs miles on end in expenses, advertising rates and so forth can be thought of by some as an abuse of power and the s--- thats goin down is a long time in comming. Just couse I have not writtin ya in while does not mean I stopped reading ya.

Aside from KLIXXX spawning out in recent months it is certainly not the first sign of change, hell we got one mag that just rolled in July called XPLICIT Magazine. Our first issue has Jenna Jameson on the cover and is staged to address behind the scenes and movie releases by various adult video manufacture's. Sin City of course is within the pages amoung several other great adult video producers. This Magazine is special, it is not industry news but behind the scenes. It's purpose is to get under the film and video scene in depth for the fans of adult. It's more focused for a specific interest.

KLIXXX is a specific interest and address's adult webmaster's, well let me just say, Damn it Joe E what took ya so long:P? So maybe we are at the beginning of a moment in adult entertainment where the facet's of the industries underhood operations are niching out to fit the new business model's that require more indepth focus on specific aspects. I have not got much love from other adult video production companies as of late, and our entry was at a key time when I feel we were open to anything that would give us a kick start on the web, initially I thought some help would come fourth from other adult video label's NO SUCH THING HAPPENED.

What to do, what to do? I turned to the droves of adult webmasters that are just a mouse click away whom have an interest in Sin City. I run between NETPOND and ADULTNETSURPRISE, YNOTOPOND, SETGO and PLRRADIO.COM. Places where Webmaster's are anxious to learn and anxious to make a buck selling a very in demand production company, I am beginning to find success.

When I first started at Sin City I called for a comming together of Adult Video production companies to co-operate on the web, and no one listened, no consolidation or effort was made, no business was done. No wait... Now that I recall I was laughed at about the matter, but now we are seeing some serious s--- come down in the late of recent events and more is staged to go so kick back relax and enjoy the ride.

Dee Calls

Puerto Rican porn star Dee phones: "I want to thank El Zorro for his comments. But please get your information straight when it comes to talking about my relationship with Rob. And I do know what my nationality is and I am proud to be Puerto Rican and black. Thanks the laughs though. And I don't drag my husband on porn sets to watch me f--- other people. And a big thank you to Truths Guardian for sticking up for us who are always being slandered by ignorant people."

Luke: "Why are you guys always getting slandered?"

Dee: "People tend to misconstrue what we say."

Brandon Iron Thanks Evil Angel

Brandon Iron writes: "Hi! I am just writing to give a huge thank you to John Stagliano and Evil Angel for a wonderful work experience in Budapest, Hungary. I had the opportunity to work for Buttman, Rocco Siffredi (for his "Initiations" line), and Christoph Clark (for his "Beautiful Girls" line). Evil Angel was extremely kind to me and I just wanted to acknowledge that. They are a first-class organization, and it was a pleasure to see how John Stagliano creates his work. Equally as interesting was being on a Rocco shoot with 4 guys (Rocco, Tao, Manual, and me) and 7 girls. Rocco's energy was incredible and I have never witnessed anything like it. So, THANK YOU EVIL ANGEL for a memorable trip. It was very special for me."

Brandon Iron with two Budapest girls Brandon, Rocco Siffredi, Budapest

Porn star Maya Divine writes Luke: Hi, I've seen the photos you have of me and they are horrible.. could you at least put a nice one up... I'll even provide it.... thanks

Brad Shaw Seeks Jenna Jameson Content

Webmaster Brad Shaw writes: Luke, I am looking to buy rights to photo and video content of Jenna Jameson. If anyone has this sort of content, and owns the rights to sell please contact me at brad@shawinternet.com . I will pay top dollar, cash.

Brad Shaw writes on Netpond: "Jenna, nothing against you, simply the people who are running your web operations and your bf who threatened to have me killed. I can not imagine threatening to make people "disappear" is good for business. This is not the Sopranos. You have the ability to make millions on the web, I hope it happens, but from my dealings with who you have running your stuff, it is far from a sure thing."

Jenna Jameson writes on Netpond: "Brad, Lets get something straight... You opened a can of worms by posting comments about my operation and the people that work with me (Meni and Jay). Now, I don't know what you were trying to prove, but, myself and co-workers took your attitude as an insult, which it was. The things you said were definately uncalled for, just because we decided not to do business with you. Do you say these things about everyone that doesn't do what you tell them to do? I understand that you have nothing against me (only that you think I'm a has-been). Which I will pay no attention to, because everyone knows that is totally untrue. I just don't appreciate all this pumped up talk about my fiance'. You know good and well, he never backed down from you, nor would he ever. I thought since you claim to be so business-minded, you never would have played into this so-called scene that was made at your booth. Why don't you just relax, and let it go. It would be in both of our best interests. Also, in the future, I would appreciate it if you tried being more respectful to me, my fiance and everyone that works for me. You attract more bees with honey than vinegar!"

Brad Shaw writes on Netpond: Jenna, I never said he backed down. I believe he wanted to beat the s--- out of me, but his "bogyguard" pulled him away. Me, I could car a less if he took a swing at me, all in a days work, life goes on. Sure he could take a swing at me, but that would not be smart, and I do not think Jay is that stupid.

I think YOU need to have a talk with him and let him know that coming over and threatening me will not work, just puts more fire under me. I do not appeciate his threat to kill me, therefore I will do what I can to be a thorn in his side until I recieve a public apology from Jay for lecturing me, then threatening to make me "disappear". Business is business, but death threats are not fun and games.

Jenna Jameson writes on Netpond: I see that your only cocern is the incident at internext. Have you said anything about the comments that you made? Why do you feel this personal vendeta? Makes me wonder. Why are you saying you are buying all Jenna material??? You have to understand, when you try to "put a thorn in Jay's side" YOU ARE PUTTING ONE IN MINE!!!!

I don't think you want to have a problem with me. I don't have time for all this kindergarden crap. Trust me, Jay wasn't threatening to kill you, he just was trying to convey to you, that you need to keep a lower profile when it comes to clubjenna.com and jennacash.com. They are of NO concern to you. PERIOD.

Brad, just a heads-up,That wasn't Jay's bodyguard... He [FearZeus@aol.com) is one of his best friends from NY. Please, don't get him involved.... Not a good idea! :)

Serge Birbrair writes: No s---, he probably is a friend of Tony Soprano, no less, scary stuff you posting, Jenna.

Jenna Jameson writes on Netpond: "Brad, Just saw your post on Luke F-rd. You want to fall into the category of one of the webmasters that rip girls off. I want you to understand something, I have worked for eight years to build my name up to where it is. I have just begun to get my feet wet when it comes to the internet. There are a lot of pirates out there using my name and likeness to make money off of something I worked so hard for. Why would you want to join them. Just to let you know, if you decide to go on with your dirty little deeds, my name is trade marked. I do not stand for anyone , I MEAN ANYONE, ripping me off. Do me a favor, rethink what you are doing. Trust me, you want me as a friend."

Brad Shaw writes on Ynottoppond.com: " Lets not forget how this all started and why Brad is so bitter. Jenna and her company wasted my time, and negotiated in bad faith on a business deal. Basically I feel they were picking my brain and had no intention of doing any business, too bad I found this out over a month after my company spent countless hours on developing a project. BTW, we are not the only company they did this to. Call it sour grapes, call it whatever ,I do not like to have my chain yanked and my time wasted."

Serge writes: "Dear God, please bless us with a NEW super porn star! little bit less tits and little bit more brains will be just fine!"

Brad writes: "Jenna, I am just collecting images and video. Who knows what I am going to do with them. Wicked sure looks like they have some good ideas though. As for illegal, of course I always consult my lawyers. I am not as dumb as I look."

Jenna Jameson responds: "Please don't twist my words, I am not threatening anyone! I weigh 107 pounds, for gods sake! I don't want Jay's friend [FearZeus@aol.com, boyhood friend of Rob Spallone from the same Queens crew] involved only because he is a family man, his wife is expecting in two weeks. As far as tag lines go, I am not here trying to promote, just clear things up. I think we all need a group hug."

Meni wrtes: "First off we did not negotiate WITH YOU. Your Boy RON, who's GONE talked to Jay a couple of times. You wasted Jay's time I guess too. What did he learn from you? Nothing. Countless hours? hee hee, what a joke. You wanted Jenna video to STREAM You didn't get it Your are PISSED simple We spoke to someone, WAY bigger than you. And guess what, he loves us and We aren't doing anything with him. So who's the Bitch? you are Brad."

Brad Shaw writes: "I am not afraid of you kickin my ass, but after what Meni told me Jay did to some guy, something about almost killing him, I am scared of him. Guess Meni was trying to shut me up. Only thing that shuts me up is food, send me lobsters, daily. Switch to $30 with trial memberships I would even send traficc, and you could easily get 500+ sign-ups a day. But they may be the problem, lack of capital for a few months til recurrings kick in."

Brad Shaw writes: "Meni, what was the point of telling me that the last guy who open his mouth to Jay had to be helicoptered to the hospital? Seems that you are trying to intimidate me. Of course did not work well. Jenna, put a muzzle on your people, they directly reflect on you!"

"Meni was just speaking the truth... Nothing wrong with that. Listen, I don't muzzle people, that's why they like working with me. Maybe you should muzzle yourself and drop 30 or 40 pounds. j/k hehehehehehehe."

Brad Shaw writes: "Me being fat only reflects poorly on me, Meni being a big mouth wise guy, relfects poorly on you. It does. As soon as Jay apologizes, I will let it slide."

Jenna Jameson responds: "I understand where you are coming from Serge, sometimes people lose their tempers, which parties on BOTH sides did. I'm sure Brad is a great business man. He just needs to stop blowing things out of proportion. I am a great business woman also, i wouldn't be where I am if I weren't. But, I am six months into my first internet venture. I am sure Brad wasn't making multi-millions when he first started. Just give me time. World domination will be mine."

A Conversation With James DiGiorgio

Jim: "How's the Zionist inquisition?"

Luke: "I had a friend from shul say he didn't want to hear from me anymore until I abandon my web site and become fully Orthodox."

Jim: "I told you they'd shun you. Luke, am I a prophet or what? I prophesied all these things for you. You ain't getting back into that shul. When you gave up your Christian roots, you gave up that forgiveness crap. You should back off a notch and go to a Reform temple."

Luke: "No, I'm going to another Orthodox shul."

Jim: "You're going to get kicked out of this one too. They'll get pressure and they'll bow to it. These people feel like you wronged them by not being honest with them. They're going to put the screws on you. They'll present a united front. You're done.

"Do these guys have to f--- their wives every two weeks?"

Luke: "That's Jewish Law."

Jim: "I've seen some ugly women walking around with these guys. I used to live in North Hollywood and see them walking to shul. Some of them are good looking. I figured some of them were never getting tapped but now I know they're getting tapped every two weeks. Do they do it with a sheet with a hole in it?"

Luke: "Nah, that's just a myth."

Jim: "Do they have full-on lustful sex?"

Luke: "Some do, sometimes. But it's usually done in a dignified way."

Jim: "So there's no pussy licking?"

Luke: "Not usually."

Jim: "I thought that was how their beards got so curly. All that pussy juice dribbles right down. Do Orthodox women just lay back and accept it or do they really get into it?"

Luke: "It varies."

Jim: "Or do they think, 'Oh s---, tonight's the night.' And they open up their legs and do their laundry list in their head."

Luke: "It varies."

Jim: "Do they wear negligees?"

Luke: "Some do."

Jim: "Who initiates the sex?"

Luke: "Usually the husband."

Jim: "And that could be anything from putting the moves on her to just climbing aboard. And probably, if your wife gets old and fat and ugly, they just climb aboard and close their eyes. What happens if a Jewish guy has problems getting it up?"

Luke: "Well, for people with severe sexual dysfunction, this great rabbi Moshe Feinstein said they could watch X-rated movies."

Jim: "No. Really? What if the problem is more physiological?"

Luke: "They're allowed to take Viagra. Jews are allowed to take any medicine, even non-kosher ones, that will help their health."

Jim: "If the guy doesn't fulfill his obligations every two weeks, is that grounds for divorce?"

Luke: "Yeah."

Jim: "Can a woman go to the rabbi and say, 'My husband is not doing me every two weeks.'"

Luke: "Yes."

Jim: "Does that happen much?"

Luke: "I'm sure it happens."

Jim: "Is it ok to use a sex surrogate?"

Luke: "No."

Jim: "Is this law [of required sex] designed to prevent promiscuity or prevent masturbation?"

Luke: "It is designed for the sake of the woman and the health of the marriage."

Jim: "Do you guys talk about this in the Jew church?"

Luke: "Some people sometimes joke about it."

Jim: "Are you allowed to have sex on the Sabbath?"

Luke: "Yes, that is encouraged. Friday night is called Mitzvah Night."

Jim: "Ohh. You go to church and you come home and have sex."

Luke: "Isn't that what you do?"

Jim: "I don't have sex. It's not because I don't go to church. It's because I'm around sex all the time. I'm just not interested. I've evolved beyond it. I'm pure. I may videotape the animals in carnal lust but I've risen above it. I look down upon it.

"I'm not antisemitic. I just find humor in Orthodox Judaism. Now that we're in the 21st Century, it is something that people cling to, that is passe. It's funny because it is such a culture clash. They're easy to make fun of, like the Amish. But because there are so many Jews in Hollywood, there will never be a movie where a bunch of Orthodox Jews are made fun of, like they do with the Amish. The Amish are not a political force. Are regular Jews afraid of Orthodox Jews?"

Luke: "Sorta. They evoke strong feelings."

Jim: "Do they see them as the true believers and there is fear and intimidation there?"

Luke: "Yes."

Jim: "They're more like the real Jew."

Luke: "Yes."

Jim: "Envy?"

Luke: "Yes."

Jim: "Like, I would never sacrifice the things in my life that I love, like money and drugs. But I envy these people. Jews don't like 'em."

Luke: "Right."

Jim: "If you go to a Jewish deli, the food seems more European than something you'd eat in Jerusalem."

Luke: "Most Jews lived in Europe for 1500 years."

Jim: "And Yiddish is like German?"

Luke: "Mixed with Hebrew."

Jim: "Why did the Jews move to Eastern Europe?"

Luke: "Because they got kicked out of everywhere else."

Jim: "They were tolerated?"

Luke: "Yes, because they wanted the Jews' commercial acumen."

Jim: "How do these Orthodox Jews make their money?"

Luke: "They're doctors, lawyers, accountants."

Jim: "Just for other Orthodox Jews?"

Luke: "No, they serve the goyim too. Orthodox Jews are perfectly happy to interact with non-Jews if they can make money off of it."

Jim: "And that's what gives Jews a bad name. They don't really want to be your friend but they want to take your money."

Luke: "They usually have no interest in developing personal relationships with people who are not Orthodox Jews. Kosher laws make it hard for them to eat with people who are not Orthodox."

Jim: "When Jews feel excluded, it really is self fulfilling. They want to be excluded."

Luke: "They want to live separate, but be able to make money however."

Jim: "But that's where it ends."

Luke: "Right. They don't want to socialize with outsiders."

Jim: "They think they're too good. They don't want to be contaminated."

Luke: "True."

Jim: "That's how the Japanese thought for a long time. It's an elitist mentality. And people don't like people who act like elitists."

Luke: "Not only do they want to keep to themselves, but they are also highly successful in the outer world."

Jim: "Jews want to have their cake and eat it too. They're really selfish people."

Luke: "They're people with a mission."

Jim: "What's the mission?"

Luke: "We're to be a light unto the nations. We show you a better way to live."

Jim: "But Jews don't want the goyim to become Jewish."

Luke: "No, but we'd like goyim to live better."

Jim: "So you're like our shepherds."

Luke: "We're to be good examples."

Jim: "No we. You're not one of them."

Luke: "Ok, they are God's pilot project for humanity."

Jim: "That's why they're not liked."

Luke: "Because we're God's Chosen People."

Jim: "Even though we continually bail them out. There'd be no Israel if it were not for the United States. Jews should consider that point. The French forgot what we did for them."

The Jewish Position On Pornography

Rabbi Lawrence Grossman writes for the American Jewish Committee:

In stark contrast to its affirmation of erotic feeling between husband and wife, traditional Judaism deems unacceptable any extra-marital sexual stimulation -- which would include pornography. Two basic motivations underly this prohibition.

First, Judaism views the sexual drive as a powerful, even overwhelming, force. It is a truism in Jewish thought that no one, not even the most pious Jew, is immune from sexual temptation. Maimonides writes that sinful sexual activity is the most difficult transgression to avoid. In the Jewish view, since mental stimulation incites to action, keeping away from thoughts of illicit sex protects the Jew from actual sin. The theory often heard from the pro-pornography side today that the availability of suggestive material functions as a safety-valve, reducing the incidence of rape and sexual molestation, is foreign to classical Judaism.

A second reason for the traditional Jewish aversion toward extramarital stimulation is the fear that erotic fantasizing -- even if it does not lead to actual sin -- will develop into a habit and seriously distort our lives. Though Judaism teaches that the world was given for human enjoyment, the purpose of life is social and spiritual improvement, not hedonism. Overindulgence in, or obsession with, any "pleasure of the flesh" diverts energy away from constructive activities and becomes an end in itself, ultimately enslaving the individual and impairing his free will. In the words of the Talmud, "the evil inclination first seems as light as a spider web; but it eventually becomes as heavy as wagon ropes." This Judaic insight has been expressed well in 20th-century terms by Irving Kristol, who notes that the search for pornographic stimulation "can quite easily become a permanent, self-reinforcing neurosis."

When the rabbis warned against thoughts of non-marital sex, they cited a number of bibical proof texts. "You shall be holy, because I, your God, am holy" (Leviticus XIX, 2), is taken to refer especially to the avoidance of sexual temptation. "And you shall not seek after the desire of your heart and your eyes which you whore after" (Numbers XV, 39), has an obvious sexual connotation, and is explained by the 11th-century commentator Rashi as follows: "The heart and the eyes function as scouts for the body, procuring transgressions for it. The eye sees, the heart desires, and the body performs the sin." "And you shall guard yourself against all evil" (Deuteronomy XXIII, 10), refers, according to the Talmud (TB Aboda Zara 20b), to erotic thoughts.

Jewish legal literature manifests disapproval of erotic stimulation outside marriage in three ways. First, there are general warnings to avoid such situations. Second, there are ritual implications: one may not recite certain prayers or engage in religious study in the presence of a sexually provocative distraction. Third, quite aside from prohibiting contact with overtly erotic stimuli, the Talmud and later authorities cautioned also against seemingly innocent situations that could conceivably lead to lust. In the words of a 20th-century scholar, "the code prohibits certain acts which make it possible for those of evil intent to welcome the opportunity for sin, and for those of weak moral fiber to be tempted into sin."

The unequivocal Jewish opposition to any stimulation of non-marital lust did not generally lead Jewish communities to enforce hard-and-fast rules regulating sexual behavior because the rabbis recognized the deeply subjective nature of the erotic drive. Unlike the Jewish dietary laws, under which a food is either kosher or not, and unlike much of the ritual law, under which an act is either prohibited or permitted, a particular sight or sound might or might not be sexually arousing, depending on the particular situation.

Farrah Interview

Chuck Martino discovered tall blonde stripper Farrah at the club Mons Venus in Tampa, Florida in 1996. She recognized him from his movies.

He brought her into porno and had a tempestuous relationship with her. After leaving Chuck, Farrah had an affair with pornographer Kevin Beechum, who was married at the time.

After that, Farrah went on to a relationship with male performer Christian Steele and a six month fling with Joseph Elkind of Cyber Entertainment Network. She's appeared in numerous strip clubs around American and in about 100 porn films.

Kevin Beechum tells Luke 7/23/98:

"I only have two contract girls (Farrah and Angelica Sinn) right now. We took back Farrah, who has drug problems. She was my girlfriend two years ago but I haven't f---ed her in two years… We're trying to get her straightened out…

"Chuck Martino is a good friend of mine. He's off the drugs and has gone straight. He's got a cute little girlfriend Shay Sweet. He looks great."

Kevin Beechum tells Luke 6/28/01

Luke: "I hear that Farrah owes you six movies?"

Kevin: "Here bro, I'll give you an answer that you can print. She calls me, dude, and I never return her calls. If she catches me when I answer the phone, that's how she talks to me. To fulfill her contract, she owes us seven pictures which equals $14,000. I'd rather have her pay me the $14,000 or have somebody buy me out of her because she's not going to shoot another movie for anybody until she fulfills this f---ing contract. She's never fulfilled one since we helped her ass out when Chuck used to beat the s--- out of her when we first got her.

"Also, this girl's a whacko case. And if she thinks she's going to make a comeback, good luck."

Luke: "Are you interested in having her make those seven movies for you?"

Kevin: "I'd rather have the money bro. But if I can't get the money, I'll stick the bitch in the f---ing movies to get my money back. I made her a deal before but she never sticks to one of her deals. I made her a deal that she could shoot one movie for me and one movie for someone else on a monthly basis. That only lasted one month. And she disappeared. She's never fulfilled one deal she's ever done. All I've done is help that chick and she's never done anything for this company.

"We made a deal with her back when she did the Vivid contract. And f---ing didn't even know what she read or did. And she f---ing thought she was a big shot because I wouldn't resign her. Then she went and did it with Vivid. And a month later she comes in here bawling. She doesn't want to work for anybody but us. So I read the contract and called Stevie up and he said, 'Just pay me back the couple gran advancement and you can have her.'

"Fine. I took her back and made her a deal with all the money she owed me. And made a new 12 picture contract with her for $24,000. She owed for previous loans, borrowing, cars, bulls---, dadadadadadada. She's never fulfilled one of those deals. She did five movies. She owes us seven."

Luke: "How well do her movies sell?"

Kevin: "They suck. Yeah dude, the only reason that people liked her is that she used to be cute. And that's when we got her, when she was young and cute and she didn't have an attitude. She's been kicked out of every dance club in America, dude. She f---ed every club there was."

Luke suspects this is a gross overstatement.

Kevin: "We had her getting high money [for stripping]. She screws up everything she does."

Luke: "I thought she was your girlfriend?"

Kevin: "Well, I used to f--- her two years ago, when she first came out here, when Chuck brought her here for six months."

Luke says: I talked to Farrah by phone early Tuesday afternoon.

Farrah: "I called Kevin [Beechum] and left him a message about his comments. Kevin has done a lot for me. He's always helped me out when I needed it. And I've helped him. I agreed to give him six free movies to pay him back. But it got to a point where I got tired of the business. I got tired of everybody's bulls---. The rumors, and ex's [boyfriends]. I've got plenty of ex's. Kevin is one of them. I just didn't need it no more. So I moved.

"I don't think it is fair of Kevin to call me a bitch and write stuff like that, saying my movies didn't sell. He's compilating my movies like Sunshine Video did. So he can't tell me that he's not making no money and that nothing was good. I go to video stores and people know me.

"I thought it was immature of him to call me a bitch. And to say that I haven't completed my contracts. I've completed at least three contracts [with him]. He gave me wonderful boxcovers but he wouldn't have had wonderful boxcovers if it wasn't for me on the front of it. He put forth money and I put forth effort. I don't see where the problem was for him to literally call me a bitch. And that's what he did.

"I never call him an asshole. I'm sure I have, when me and him were arguing. Once me and him stopped f---ing, all my s--- went downhill. Literally."

Luke: "Why did you leave the industry?"

Farrah: "Because of all the gossip. I've got too many ex's. I've done a 100 movies. How much further do I need to go? I've established for myself a name which KBeech Video has helped me do and Chuck Martino helped me do. They can't take the total credit for it. I did it. I got raked through the business. I went through the s---. I took the s---. And I established a name and I see no further reason to keep f---ing [on video]."

Luke: "I thought you were going to come back to doing videos."

Farrah: "I was going to do that until this [Kevin's remarks] came up. I would've loved to have made movies with VCA, Metro and people like that. I already did Vivid. There's a lot of other stuff in the industry that I could be doing with other companies. I know I owe Kevin six movies. I just didn't think his comments were appropriate. So why should I kiss his ass?"

Luke: "When did you start in the industry?"

Farrah: "It was 1996. I was dancing at Mons Venus in Tampa. He came up to me and said, 'What are you doing rubbing dick? You could be a star.' I was like, 'Ok.' I recognized him. Everybody knows what happened between us. Just look at his patterns of ex-girlfriends. Then I met Kevin and Kevin helped me out and he's been helping me out since. I just can't see why he can't give me no credit."

Luke: "This is a brutal industry."

Farrah: "Besides I'm not f---ing him anymore. It is a brutal industry. I think I did it well. I had people who helped me do it well. I also think I got f---ed in between. I can contradict between liking somebody and not liking somebody. Saying that somebody helped me and yet... That's why I just chose to walk away from it. I have not done a movie in at least a year. Not because Kevin pissed me off.

"I appreciate Kevin letting me walk away from it. He was the one who got me out of the business for the eight months we were dating. He knew I didn't like it. And he didn't like his girlfriend or his mistress doing it. Except girl-girl. And it even took a while for me to do that. But I do not appreciate him talking s--- like that. There's no reason."

Luke: "Did you have a drug problem at one time? Are you willing to talk about that?"

Farrah: "I think everybody's had some kinda problem whether it's being with assholes, or a drug problem, or a low self esteem problem. I won't say I had a drug problem. I'm sure Kevin has made his statements on that. When I was with Chuck Martino, I never did one drug. I did not do drugs. Once me and Chuck split up, Kevin was the one I partied with. So if he wants to get down to nitty gritty stuff, I started partying hard with him. It wasn't Chuck, it was with him.

"Going to Vegas, going here, going there. And I had a great time. But once we weren't f---ing anymore, next thing you know, I'm a druggie. I'm this and that. I'm not saying that I don't do drugs. I drink. I smoke pot. At one time, when I was depressed, I, I don't know, I went on a, uhh, I won't say a binge or nothing. I was just depressed. You know, I had just had the s--- beat out of me. Then I had a married man, which I was dumb enough to be with, turn around and say, 'Hey, we've got to stop everything right now.' And still remain business partners. After we've been telling each other we love each other.

"I went through a depression and an abortion. It's no reason to go get totally f---ed up but you know, you learn. I was happy being f---ed up at the time. Sometimes being f---ed up, I don't know, it helps. You end up hitting rock bottom and realize it. At least I did. I'm glad I did."

Luke: "It is difficult to sustain relationships in this industry."

Farrah: "It's very difficult especially with a married man and a wife beater. And then there was Christian Steele, a suitcase pimp. I got tired of all of it. I got tired of going on sets and knowing I was getting paid for the six movies I had already done. And getting a s---ty boxcover at the same time. My boxcovers turned out to be gonzo boxes.

"He'll tell you, 'Oh, her stuff wasn't selling.' You can ask anybody in that office, my stuff did sell. I asked the people in the shipping room. He [Kevin] would give me a complex. 'Oh, it doesn't sell. You need to f--- more guys. You need to do this or that.' And I would ask people in the shipping room and the good people who work for him, and sell my movies. And they tell me that they sell. So I don't know what kind of mindf--- he was trying to pull.

"He's a great guy but he's an ex."

Luke: "Why do you think you've chosen the men you've chosen?"

Farrah: "I like bad guys. The man I'm with now, which is a great great man. I love him to death. We've been together six months. We met in Miami. I've been staying here in New York eversince I met him. It's just that bad boy thing. It's the look. It's the attitude. With confidence and with financially and everything behind it. And it's become a pattern. And hopefully one of these patterns is going to give me somebody good. I hope this one is.

"It's great. He's got a wonderful family. Everyone accepts me and my big tits. No questioning of what I've done and nothing."

Luke: "Do you regret getting into this industry?"

Farrah: "I do not regret anything I do. I learn from what I do but I don't regret dating a married man... It's just all learning experiences. It's got to get better."

Luke: "Where do you think you are going from here in the adult industry?"

Farrah: "As long as Kevin's got his thing... It's not that I want an apology. I just don't need. I mean, calling me a bitch, how immature is that? I could just see him behind his desk, 'Bro this' and 'Bro that.' 'She's this. She's that.' With people walking in and out of his office for him to impress. He's helped me so many times but every time he's helped me, I've always paid him back. I've always given him his money back. I don't owe him nothing but six free movies.

"When my last contract was up, I told him, 'I want to go shoot movies with other people and let our contract finish.' I even spoke to a lawyer and he said, 'You can get out of this. Nobody can make you f--- in the first place.'

"I'm sure one day I will do another one. When I went to Los Angeles recently, people wanted me to do a movie. I told them my price and that I wanted the boxcover. And they were more than happy to give it to me. I'm not fresh but I'm fresh in other people's movies. So I was thinking about that until I heard this bulls--- [from Kevin Beechum]. Why should I give something to someone who doesn't appreciate what I've already done?

"Chuck [Martino] thinks that Olivia and I broke into his house. Because he had all my stuff. We went over there and knocked on the door. Can you picture me and Olivia breaking into someone's home? If you hear from him, I didn't do it.

"Ok Luke, I'm going back to watching my soap operas."

Luke Talks About Himself

XXX: Hello Luke...happy indy day..i have some thoughts to share about your shul situation...if you care to listen. I believe that there may be things going on that werent revelaed to you....just some ideas.
XXX: if they thought you had certain value to them..ALL situations have ways of change and overcoming.
XXX: i have to believe that otrher factors were at play in their minds.
XXX: did anyone ever approach you in conversations about marriage?
Luzdedos1: only once did i get set up with anybody, i basically discouraged it for the reason that it could blow up when the girl found out about my web site and blamed the person who set us up.
XXX: and about your conversion?
Luzdedos1: they wanted me to go through another conversion, more rigorous
XXX: luke first off.in their eyes..no matter what they say to your face.in their hearts and behind your back..you are always less in there hypocritical eyes.
XXX: and i suggest....becauise of your single status....that they question your true intentions and your "straightness".if you get my drift....appearances are everything?
XXX: they want single men to marry....and to have children..
XXX: you are a square peg in their congregations round hole..
Luzdedos1: yes, i figure if i can get married, i will be much better off
XXX: so many factors in one individual...they just gave it all the time they could.then they probably decideed that it was a lost cause for them.
XXX: the site was just them letting you and themselves off easy
XXX: consider all your factors.....
XXX: single.....and not close to marriage. No kids.....goes together
XXX: questionable resources
XXX: questionable....ahem..sexuality
XXX: questionable occupation..
XXX: questionable mental status?
XXX: you just havent always been one with god.their god......no matter what.its always your star of david to bear..
XXX: you must see the looks you get when you speak of your conversion with them...
XXX: they change.because you change,.in their eyes. such a handsome goy in our midst?.....walls go up.
XXX: luke.....they knew about your site from day one...dont be naive.
XXX: luke...they had you checked out once you walked in teh door.
XXX: all it takes is one call.....dont be silly.they knew all along.they were testing you..your ablity to be trusted etc..
XXX: i cant believe that you never revealed this stuff to them in an open and honest way.
XXX: they despise fear and respect strength of will....discipline. mental toughness......chutzpah...
XXX: a strong jew is a good jew.....in all eyes...above
XXX: havent you realized all these factors?
Luzdedos1: i'm not giving up my web site and taking a regular job to get back in
XXX: well.ok...you have made your choice.not to work with them and to include them in your life.
Luzdedos1: I want to be with them, but I am not going to give up my job for it
XXX: luke.....free speech and the word of god dont always mix well.
Luzdedos1: yes, i want to marry a jewish woman and create a family
XXX: and its something that you are now in the process of pursuing? Have you consulted rabbis? The rabbis have the connections to set you up nicely......just as you seek them..so do others.

Helpful writes: "questionable....ahem..sexuality." Please! Such rubbish! I've been out in public with Luke and it's down right embarrassing how his head spins around whenever a skirt passes by. I give more credence to the theory that his expulsion stemmed from his penchant for wearing black clodhopper shoes with white socks and plaid shorts to shul.

Rumdar writes: Yeah! but is her looking at the girl or the guy she is with :) Let's give him the benefit of the doubt . OK, then the reason has to be that he refused to take some Ortho Jewess as Mrs. Ford and f--- her twice a week (or was it once)? every week (according to Torah wishes) for the rest of his life. That means even when Mrs. Ford is old and decrepit and looks about as appealing as old Rabbi Shulman. I don't blame him. I'd want no part of that either. But you might have a point. The shoes and socks didn't help. Luke looks like Charlie Chaplin in that great silent flic The Gold Rush when wearing his Klondike Klodhoppers.

Chaim Amalek writes: The bottom line is that you do not have jewish genes, and for that reason alone the orthodox don't want you in. They have built for themselves a tribal faith based on bloodlines, and unless one has a lot to contribute along with his goyishe genes, he is not welcome. The rest is just detail. If you were a notorious pimp or hollywood producer creating poison for the goyim, you would be welcome everywhere with open arms - if you had jewish genes. So be a man, and look elsewhere for spiritual fulfillment.

Rumdar writes: I have a question. What then does a dark skinned 6' 7" Ethiopian Jew (the ones rescued and flown out by the Israeli Army some years ago) have in common gene wise with Eric. Eric is a Jewish guy from somewhere in Russia I was friendly with who is medium height, with curly natural blond hair and pale white skin. Do the Ethiopian and Eric share the same genes? Pardon my ignorance for asking but it has been on my mind for a while.

Chaim Amalek replies: A very good question and the answer is not much. The ignorant rabbis thought that the falasha jews of ethiopia were blood kin (some sort of lost tribe) and so prevailed upon the government of israel to bring them to israel. Since then, DNA testing of jews world-wide has revealed that yes indeed, jews are tribally related to another, genetically speaking. Except for the falashas. No blood kinship there.

Judaism is not, strictly speaking, a religion in the inclusive sense of christianity, or a race, since while difficult, it is possible to convert to judaism (whereas a caucasian cannot convert to being black). Still, the religion does erect enormous barriers against outside blood from coming in, which while not insurmountable, almost are so. This is one of the reason the rabbis are so furious at the enourmous rate of intermarriage between jews and gentiles in the West. It is weakening the blood ties that bind virtually all jews together. It would be like white people marrying negroes or hordes of hispanics flowing into the United States. Clearly not healthy for the American nation.

And as an aside, there IS a tribe of negroes somewhere in Africa that is descended of jews from way back when. they live in or near South Africa, and have been shown by DNA testing to be descendants of jewish men, likely traders, who traveled there a few thousand years back, as per their local customs and legends. (Unlike their neighbors, they do not eat pork.)

Alesh writes: Luke, What do you think of this story? As an american Jew of Fa'lasha descent, I am torn. It illustrates why the black american hates jews. My experience is that many (not all) American Jews believe this.

A tape recording of the lecture revealed [Tel Aviv basketball coach Pini] Gershon saying of black players: "There are two shades of blacks. There's the light-skin, who are a lot smarter than the dark blacks - those are really dummies. The dark ones are like slaves; whatever you tell them to do, they'll do without thinking about it. They usually come from the streets."

Chaim Amalek responds: Wasn't the key impetus for zionism the understanding that multiculturalism/tribal diversity does not work, and that every people needs its own homeland?

The Final Solution to the Israel Problem will come about only when the Israeli's follow the lead of the western nations and amend their Law of Return so that Jews have no preference over Palestinians.

And yes, there is a contradiction buried in this email, which the Juden ought to be happy the goyim have not yet figured out. But they will, but they will.

Steve writes Luke: "Your shul will welcome you back if you drop or otherwise clean up your website. I daresay your fellow porners, or at least those who revile you, have not held out a similarly redeeming hand. You were doing well when you were accepting your own culpability in these matters. Now you are resorting to blaming. The whole point about Judaism is that you are not "fodder" for religion, you are someone to be reclaimed, however rough hewn your behavior and character. Or so it seems."